Playing correctly.

[ericlambi]

I love it. If he calls all his chips on a draw, then you should be happy. This is how you make money at poker (presuming you wouldn't play the same way). I think too many people here are trying to get bad players to make correct folds on draws -- make them do in correct calls. The key (and this is the part I struggle with personally) is not paying them off when they hit, because then you just made their draw correct.

[rybones]

The best part is that people read this that I would not push with trip Queens. I was merely presenting a situation that I hate.

[11t]

The most likely hands he has, unless he is just terrible, that he would call a pot sized raise on both streets are AJs if he is in lp or AKs if he is in ep. A set of 10's is also a possibility. I do not think you can bet again without putting yourself all in so I say push and if he calls and you get river'd so be it.

Doubling up early can be nice.

[spentrent]

STOP HATING IT!

[rybones]

This is my favorite reply! nothing about the fictional hand I created should tell you he is slow playing A,A or K,K. I don't care if this is a 10 or 200 sng. you might limp with A,A but you try to get all your chips in the middle pre-flop when you get action like the Queens gave. Additionally Aces or Kings might check raise this flop but I doubt it as they are worried about the same draws as I described.

Alas, just my thoughts.

Ryan

[rybones]

OK, the reality is that I don't hate it. but I wanted to create a scenerio where that presented some discussion. That said this does happen often at the $10 level. For those with limited bankroll issues this can be a scary situation.

Now let me make it real for you those of you who say this is no big deal. Play this hand out in the much the same way, but imagine that this is level 7 of a step 5 and it is down to 5. you bought in at the 11+1 and making the money here will mean a real vacation for you and your spouse. like the first plane vacation since you had kids.

blinds t150/300
SB t2000 + 150 blind
BB t1500 +300 blind
utg t6050
co t1600
you t3400 with Q,Q

utg is lag and has been really catching some hands. co is weak tight.

pre-flop is still limp, limp. You figure you want co to yourself as he likely has a lower pp as he would have raised the lag with aces or kings. you raise to 900. To your amazement both call and the flop is Q, T, 4 with two spades. the pot is now t3150. The action is check, push, and now you of course push. Or wait, you now realize if you push there will be t6350 in the pot and utg will only need to call t1600. He is going to call with any draw at all. Oh wait, logically I want him to call, I have the nuts. Wait, what if he has K,J spades. Oh god here I go. Then you push and sure enough utg calls with K,J spades. Are you telling me you aren't scared to death as you wait for the river? are you telling me that his call doesn't make you nervous? you are full of crap if you say no.

Remember that playing the 10+1 tables can be a lot of money for some people. I use them to help pay bills that wouldn't otherwise get paid. If I loose that coin flip I described in my first post it does really mean something.

Again, these are just my thoughts.

Ryan

[AtticusFinch]

[ QUOTE ]
found yourself in a game where you were outmatched or evenly matched, it would be better to play perfect poker and hope to get lucky.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you are capable of playing this theoretically perfect poker, how likely are you to be outmatched, though?

Perhaps you could be outmatched in "reading" ability. In that case, the game theory additions to perfect poker discussed in the theory of poker would allow you to overcome any read an opponent might get on you.

I guess this is a roundabout way of saying I agree. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[sofere]

[ QUOTE ]
Are you telling me you aren't scared to death as you wait for the river? are you telling me that his call doesn't make you nervous? you are full of crap if you say no.

[/ QUOTE ]

If I was one away from the money in a step 5, absolutely I'll be nervous in this situation. I'll be nervous in any situation if I'm playing for a couple grand. Calling all-in with AA preflop i'll be nervous.

My hands would probably be shaking as I move the slider over to all-in and press the raise button. And if he calls and shows KJs, I'll probably need a new pair of pants.

But the point is though my hands are shaking and I'm down $30 on a new pair of pants, I still hit that raise button.

[pastabatman]

[ QUOTE ]
This is my favorite reply! nothing about the fictional hand I created should tell you he is slow playing A,A or K,K.

[/ QUOTE ]
Ok, guess I'm the dunce. Mind you, I didn't say this was the most likely holding. But I've seen such hands played that way, in my admittedly short SNG experience. If he's in love with his AA, he could very well think he's leading you down the path to ruin by slow-playing until you stop spewing chips.

[ QUOTE ]
The best part is that people read this that I would not push with trip Queens.

[/ QUOTE ]

Alas, what fools we are. But you said at the beginning of your post:[ QUOTE ]
However, I still don't know what to do.

[/ QUOTE ]

[stripsqueez]

[ QUOTE ]
being overconfident in your read can be a huge mistake

[/ QUOTE ]

over confident is never right - but - the usual problem is not being confident in your read

[ QUOTE ]
the flip side of playing an unbeatable strategy is that you make less on average than you would if you adjusted your strategy to exploit your opponents weaknesses

[/ QUOTE ]

i dont have any big issues with what your post is saying but i think the way it is expressed is a problem - there are not 2 different ways to play - lorindas proposition is like the nose on your face but the reason its of interest is that mainstream theory expresses itself poorly by doggedly describing the game as a maths problem when in fact its just another card game played by people

stripsqueez - chickenhawk