Typical preflop situation

[Klepton]

they talked about this about a month ago but on the party 15 instead. On the 15 its an easy call, because you're gettig 5:1 on a 7.5:1, but add the implied odds and it merits a call. In vegas I think it would be a fold (because of the 5-bet possibility).

[fearme]

u wanna play 66 versus aa and kk???? u dont make much sense,

[fearme]

u would still call??? makes a lotta sense , chase the overpair down and possibly lose a monster pot in a set over set

[fearme]

who says tight players go for many bets??? tight refers to there range of hands, not there aggression

[Chris Daddy Cool]

[ QUOTE ]
u would still call??? makes a lotta sense , chase the overpair down and possibly lose a monster pot in a set over set

[/ QUOTE ]

fearing set over set is just scared poker. if you knew these two had AA and KK, folding 66 here would be ridiculous.

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]
You're getting better than 5-1.

[/ QUOTE ]


Yes...you are definitely getting better than 5-1.

CO will call the cap of course. The SB and BB have folded their dead-money.
Already in the pot are:
your 2
the CO's 4 (because you KNOW he will call)
the button's 4
the SB's 0.6
the BB's 1

That's 11.6 in the pot and it costs you 2 to call.
Almost 6 to 1.


Plus....I agree that IF you hit your set you will be extracting quite a bit from at least one of the cappers thus giving you adequate implied-odds (partly lost on the risk of losing big on set over set....but not enough of a factor that you shouldn't do it here).

This is certainly a call imo.

[Nick B.]

Ok, I was just venting to James about the hand because I got my KK sucked out on. His details are a little messed up.

You open in emp with a raise with 66. Loose player 3bets in lp, I (tight player) cap in the bb, This almost always means big pair.

The 66 is facing 2 cold back to him gettin ~5-1. He is 7.5-1 to flop a set. Even if he does flop a set, he still needs to make up a couple bets, and not get sucked out on. I don't know what the actual numbers are, but I know that he won't win a flopped set 100% of the time. And when he is behind he will lose a lot of money before he knows that he is behind (against sets and 4-flushes that come on the river).

Anyways, I was just venting to James because I was having a bad night. I don't think it was the right call with only 2 other people in the pot, with one having a big pair.

[MicroBob]

This does change things.

One of the players IS the BB so that is one fewer bet in the pot.

From LP1 (CO-1 or LP3 or whatever it is) it looks like a battle for the blinds. your open-raise can just be viewed as a steal-attempt.

From EMP you have to assume the other players (if they are decent) are giving you credit for a good hand.
If both the LP and the BB are good players (and thus, should know that your raise from EMP means something) then I recommend folding for 2-cold back to you.


FWIW - I would muck 66 PF here unless it's an unusually loose-passive table. I might raise 77 though....and am very likely to raise 88. So I don't entirely disagree with raising 66 here....it's just a shade outside my realm of aggressiveness that's all.



Interesting how I view this situation as having significantly changed with just a couple of minor alterations to the hand.

[Luke]

Ok, I was just venting to James about the hand because I got my KK sucked out on.

Nick, you don't say exactly what happened but my guess is that your oppponent hit his set and extracted a number of bets from you.

Perhaps the fact that he was able to gain some extra bets beyond the immediate ~5-1 that he was getting adds some proof to the fact that this is a call preflop.

Luke

[surfdoc]

[ QUOTE ]
who says tight players go for many bets??? tight refers to there range of hands, not there aggression

[/ QUOTE ]

I think it is a pretty safe assumption to make that these guys 3 betting and capping preflop are aggressive and capable of tossing in mucho bets on a 469 board if one or both has an overpair.