KJo UTG

[dfscott]

[ QUOTE ]
I always limp with KJ from an early position (exceptions found in late stages of NL tournaments but thats about it).

k

[/ QUOTE ]

I've gotten KJo just over 150 times out of the blinds (and 50 times in the blinds -- seems a little high).

Overall, it's a slight winner for me out of the blinds. Of the 40 times I've gotten in 5 or greater from the button, I'm a loser. In the other direction, I'm a winner. (From the blinds, it's a huge dog.)

Probably not enough to be statistically significant, but I thought I'd share...

[Sarge85]

My thoughts:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...680#Post878662

Sarge[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

[gojacketz]

Playing KJo UTG in any full ring game is a leak.

Gojacketz

[kenewbie]

[ QUOTE ]
This is a huge cop out. Long before pokertracker many books already analyzed KJo. Many of the stuff written were by much better players than you probably are. Ya think they may be on to something?


[/ QUOTE ]

You are correct in both assumtions ofcourse. Books are written and I am far far worse than every single one of those authors I'm sure. Very few of those books where written for the kind of horrible (measured in opponents skill, not income) games that are the micro limits though.

But seeing how vigorously you argue for mucking them I'm getting a feeling I'm way off base here though.

k

[kenewbie]

[ QUOTE ]

I love to hear people say this -- this is why poker continues to be profitable.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, I know how that statement would sound, hence the smilie at the end of it.

And while it is true, I do play based on what hands I "feel I'm profitable with", it's not a total shot in the dark. I keep enough records to know that I'm a winning player at my level and a decent one at that, but I dont keep them _that_ detailed.

[ QUOTE ]

An extreme example, yes, but just goest to show that going on hunches doesn't work to track long-term results.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yes I agree, and the reason I posted is that I feel somewhat on thin ICE with this hand. But rather than post a "should I muck KJo in EP?" and then simply say "ok" to whatever the concensus might be, I prefer to defend my current position.

[ QUOTE ]

Why do you care how you get them if PT gets them for you? I never even see mine. I start PT and PP, log in to PP, crank up the requestor, and start playing.


[/ QUOTE ]

Has there been some revisions in PT then? The last time I had a look at it you have to request the hand histories every 100 hands in the poker client and then save them from the mailclient to the disk (because PT does not support IMAP, but uses the plaintext POP protocol) and then import.

k

[kenewbie]

[ QUOTE ]
Overall, it's a slight winner for me out of the blinds. Of the 40 times I've gotten in 5 or greater from the button, I'm a loser. In the other direction, I'm a winner. (From the blinds, it's a huge dog.)


[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you. I just found that EV based on position chart thats taken from live hands at one of the online pokersites. The fact that it shows KJo as having negative EV on every position but the last 3 should also be a tipoff I guess.

k
Probably not enough to be statistically significant, but I thought I'd share...

[/ QUOTE ]

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
Very few of those books where written for the kind of horrible (measured in opponents skill, not income) games that are the micro limits though.

[/ QUOTE ]

Most will say why hands like KJo, QJo, QTo, JTo and the like don't play well in multiway pots especially from EP.

It's a matter of why certain hands play better against certain textures. Micro limit is not a new undiscovered texture. It's well covered. Both in books and on this forum.

b

[purnell]

[ QUOTE ]

A lot of the posters here say they muck this hand, I belive that is giving away too much at 0.5/1. You have the horrible players outkicked with a jack, and those who "adjust" to the loose/passive tables by playing Kxs will also give you a few nickles if you dont overplay your hand.


[/ QUOTE ]

This I don't get. I'm playing against bad players, so I should play bad too?

[Brian]

Hi purnell,

When you're playing against extraordinarily bad players, you can definitely loosen up a lot, especially in later position. But I wouldn't go so far as to play this offsuit trash UTG. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

-Brian

[dfscott]

[ QUOTE ]

Has there been some revisions in PT then? The last time I had a look at it you have to request the hand histories every 100 hands in the poker client and then save them from the mailclient to the disk (because PT does not support IMAP, but uses the plaintext POP protocol) and then import.

k

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe so, but I'll qualify -- they support Coral, Empire, InterTops, Multi, Paridise, Party, Stars, and Pokerroom (i.e., if you're on UB or Absolute, you're right -- you're screwed). As long as I've had PT, you can crank that puppy up and it will request X hands every Y minutes (you set the X and Y).

There's two ways to get around the IMAP issue. The first (and easiest), is just to get a free POP mail address (yahoo, hotmail, etc.) and use that. Options two is to use the "Check e-mail" options, which will check your Outlook/Outlook Express client directly. I'm not sure how well it works because I've only used it once, but it's better than nothing.

For the record, I agree that it would be a drag to manually import them all...