How much of a difference does being suited make HU?

[MAxx]

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Are u defending against UTGraise from BB with small pairs like 77-22? I guess u do? (at least 44 and up?)


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Typically i do defend 44+. Sometimes 22 and 33.

I think 44 is worth defending, while the possibility of drawing to a 4 is not as worthy of defending.

[kiddo]

In your first post u wrote:

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you could pair a four or five, but that is not really all that desireable

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In next post:

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I think 44 is worth defending

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U also wrote:

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the possibility of drawing to a 4 is not as worthy of defending.

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We are not calling with 54s in BB because we are drawing for a 4. We are drawing for straight, flush, 4s or 5s.

[kurosh]

Against a TAG UTG raise, the difference between 77 and 22 is negligable.

[Poldi]

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Are u defending against UTGraise from BB with small pairs like 77-22? I guess u do? (at least 44 and up?)


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Typically i do defend 44+. Sometimes 22 and 33.

I think 44 is worth defending, while the possibility of drawing to a 4 is not as worthy of defending.

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What is better about 44 than 33 or 22 in this case? Its not like you are going to lose to a pair of 4´s ever when defending 22 in this spot. I think they are exactly the same here so it doesnt make sense to me to defend one of them but dump the others.

[Trix]

Ofcourse there is, you will make a flush more often, but maybe more important, will flop a draw you can play hard and maybe take it down unimproved, which would make suitedness more important vs later raises than early ones as it´s easier to bluff successfully I think.

There are tons of hands I defend suited that I fold offsuit against button opens.

[kurosh]

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Ofcourse there is, you will make a flush more often, but maybe more important, will flop a draw you can play hard and maybe take it down unimproved, which would make suitedness more important vs later raises than early ones as it´s easier to bluff successfully I think.

There are tons of hands I defend suited that I fold offsuit against button opens.

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I think the thread has gone off on somewhat of a tangent so I'll try to get it back on track.

TStone said you flop a flush draw 10% of the time (if it's wrong, blame him.) The semibluff is a powerful tool, but you'll only be able to use it 10% of the time. The lower bound of my defense is 76o and, for me, the only thing suitedness does is maybe add 65s and MAYBE 75s.

[Trix]

I defend more Kings, Queens, Jacks etc aswell.

As far as I reember it´s 8.1:1 to flop a flushdraw (might have been 9.1 though, which explains why tstone thinks it´s 10%).

Sometimes a 3flush will be enough to change a fold to a play aswell.

[ALL1N]

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How much of a difference does being suited make HU?

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A little bit. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

It's a feel thing. You're probably better off giving examples of 76o vs 74s or KTo vs K8s, btw.

[David BB]

As Trix said. Its not so much the hot & cold percentages that makes a suited hand more valuable HU, but the extra semi-bluff opportunities.

And I think being suited is more valuable vs. a button raise since you're more likely to successfully semi-bluff a button raiser.

[bobbyi]

If you always fold hands like KT, you will be underdefending and this is exploitable by an opponent raising a wide range of hands to take your blinds. If you always call with hands like this, you will exploitable by people who simply wait for good hands and keep getting to play their AK against your KT and by people who make moves against you postflop knowing that you will too often have a non-pair non-ace hand that can't get to a showdown.

To be game theoretically balanced, you need to employ a mixed strategy and call with hands like this some percentage of the time rather than always calling or always folding. You want to play a hand like this in the ballpark of a quarter of the time. So, you use the cards as a randomizing factor. By usually playing a hand like KT when it is suited and folding it when it is not, you balance your play; your tendencies are not predictable since you are using an external source of entropy (the cards) rather than trying to randomize yourself by feel, which often leads to playing in patterns that your opponents may notice even if you don't; and if you are going to play a hand about a quarter of the time, you might as well play the best quarter, which are the suited ones.

This is the real signicance of suitedness HU, not the ability to make a flush, which is just a bonus.