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#11
12-02-2004, 05:16 PM
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Re: All-In Orgy
the only way you are in big trouble with top set is if you are up against something like 99 and 98 as well as the nuts. TT v. QJ v. 98 is even enough equity to make calling OK though. it might be closer than i originally thought if i tie up lots of 9's and 8's but i think calling with top set still looks OK to me. something i am missing?
-tpir 
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#12
12-02-2004, 05:21 PM
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Re: All-In Orgy
TT v QJ v 98
that's almost a 4:1 dog! EDIT: you're not missing anything, you're right. I'm just stupid and not paying attention [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].
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#13
12-02-2004, 05:33 PM
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Re: All-In Orgy
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#14
12-02-2004, 05:36 PM
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Re: All-In Orgy
never mind, I'm an idiot!
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#15
12-02-2004, 05:41 PM
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Re: All-In Orgy
[ QUOTE ]
TT v QJ v 98 that's almost a 4:1 dog! [/ QUOTE ] TT's EV in this situation is .282. So wouldn't that be more of a .718 / .282 = 2.54:1 dog, thus having odds to call here? With top set I call. I think with the 88 this is a fold. An overset just kills your chance to win the pot. Edit: Nm, you caught it. As for the other hands, I think I'd fold J7 and 76 because QJ is so likely out there. 99 is definitely the toughest decision. It probably is a fold, because if you're up against a set, you're either drawing nearly dead or have fewer outs to fill up.
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#16
12-02-2004, 06:17 PM
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Re: All-In Orgy
once upon a time, a long long time ago, the board came T86 rainbow, and you got all in with 66 and deep stacks on the flop. that was against one opponent (me). now you have two. i call with QJ or TT only. maybe J7 if the stars align right. maybe your hand if the other two are playing crazy.
does everyone see how bad JT is here? and yet you constantly see otherwise good players go all in with top pair / single-card open-ender. matt
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#17
12-03-2004, 03:51 AM
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Re: All-In Orgy
Very Odd, I was going to post a hand 2 days ago where I called a 4xBB raise with 100xBB+ stacks in the SB with J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] and saw a flop multiway of T98r, I bet about 3/4 of the pot and the original raiser went all in. I debated and eventually folded thinking if he raised with QQ I was really cooked, but it wasn't until this thread that I actually REALLY thought about it.
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#18
12-03-2004, 04:28 AM
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Re: All-In Orgy
[ QUOTE ]
Very Odd, I was going to post a hand 2 days ago where I called a 4xBB raise with 100xBB+ stacks in the SB with J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] and saw a flop multiway of T98r, I bet about 3/4 of the pot and the original raiser went all in. I debated and eventually folded thinking if he raised with QQ I was really cooked, but it wasn't until this thread that I actually REALLY thought about it. [/ QUOTE ] I think this is a much different scenario, because in your situation you have OESD (albeit 1 card) + top pair heads up. I'd still make the above fold, (wow, what an overbet by PFR...) but it plays differently heads up then in ML4L's case where it seemed everyone was jumping to put money in the pot.
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#19
12-03-2004, 03:19 PM
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Re: All-In Orgy
I think you have to fold 8's. You will be crushed way to often by a higher set, and will almost never be a significant favorite.
With T's, you have to call. You are getting odds to outdraw a straight, and have a chance of crushing someone else's set. 9's are borderline IMO, and any straight other than QJ should be an easy fold because you have no good redraw.
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