Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)

IMO this is a pretty easy preflop call.

Boz is right about post flop. Either cap the flop and lead the turn or c/r the turn. I like capping the flop and leading b/c you will get really paid off is someone has something like a2. You definitely missed a couple of bets there at least.

[Felipe]

I like this discussion. These are the small things that add a lot of dough to the bankroll at the end of the year. I struggle with these events too. Blind play is delicate. My default play, in a multiway pot like this one, is to call with S.C. and a Qxs, Jxs. I'm not counting on my top pair, though, mostly a straight (if the cards connect) or a flush (which could get beat - but meh, that's poker).

[Walker]

Maybe I gave CO too much credit. He's loose as [censored] pf, and opens in EP with lotsa stuff. Oddly, he doesn't raise AQ,AJ,KQ, mid pairs behind lotsa limpers in LP. He reads hands real well post flop, makes protection raises with marginal hands, bluffs, but he ain't no Daniel Negreanu.

Anyways, what other trash should I be calling in this spot? If all the limpers are loose/passive dipshits, how loose can I get in the SB in an unraised pot?

[bwana devil]

im w/ boz. bad preflop call. you put the button raiser on QQ+,AK, maybe AJs and think your hand is worth an SB? nope, you got lucky.

and you soft played your boat on the flop by not capping and then you led out on the turn. why? big potential for a few big bets there. either do one or the other. cap the flop or check raise the turn.

bwana

[bozlax]

[ QUOTE ]
Oddly, he doesn't raise AQ,AJ,KQ, mid pairs behind lotsa limpers in LP.

[/ QUOTE ]

AH-HAH! That was exactly my point about questioning why he limped instead of raising! I LOVE BEING RIGHT.

[ QUOTE ]
Anyways, what other trash should I be calling in this spot? If all the limpers are loose/passive dipshits, how loose can I get in the SB in an unraised pot?

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, I wouldn't have called this in the BB. In the SB, for 0.5SB, with a few limpers and a BB that's unlikely to raise behind you, it all depends on how happy you are with your postflop play (which was not great in this hand), and how likely you think it is that the players in the pot with you will call down with second-best-type hands. As has been said many times, tho, it's impossible to give you a laundry-list of hands as it all depends on the table conditions, your ability, and your comfort level.

[Felipe]

BOZ. Do you fold this against 8 limpers on the button at a LP table? Q2s...

[tiltaholic]

[ QUOTE ]
Table know's I play a solid TAG style. I've been playing with these same guys for 5+ hrs + I've played with most of them before, so I have a good handle on how each of them plays.

4 any-two-will-do limpers call, CO (loose but particularily good postflop player) calls, button raises (basically a loose/passive; his range here is QQ+,AK,maybe AJs+; but CO doesn't know this) I call from BB Q2s.

Flop: Q22 (two hearts)

I bet, CO raises, button 3 bets, I call, CO calls.

turn is a brick; I bet and both call. River is a brick; I bet button calls.

Did I miss any bets here? Is this pf call ok? What other trash (that I wouldn't play on the button for one bet)should I be calling with here?

I really wonder if I play too tight from the blinds in games like this. I mean after bunch of players who literally play any two cards and are brutal post flop, limp, isn't something like A8o, K9o, 86o, etc, worth seeing the flop for half price in the SB?

[/ QUOTE ]

i think i'd have to call this preflop.

first of all, after 4 limpers, the "good postflop player" could be limping in with all kinds of marginal hands in a game like this.

second of all, i see a 7 way pot so infrequently that i'm calling with Q2s getting an immediate 8:1 and likely getting 13:1

13:1 people. do i remember this correctly but don't we flop a 4-flush 10% of the time or something similar to that?

[bozlax]

[ QUOTE ]
BOZ. Do you fold this against 8 limpers on the button at a LP table? Q2s...

[/ QUOTE ]

No (especially since I'm playing at an 11-handed table). That's very different than 3 loose limpers, a good limper and a passive raiser, out of position, however.

[Vote4Pedro]

[ QUOTE ]
AH-HAH! That was exactly my point about questioning why he limped instead of raising! I LOVE BEING RIGHT.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Oh no, a 'good' post flop player just limped in a live 4/8 game...hes obviously waiting for the passive button to raise, allowing him to C/R and trap the entire field for two bets"

[bozlax]

[ QUOTE ]
13:1 people. do i remember this correctly but don't we flop a 4-flush 10% of the time or something similar to that?

[/ QUOTE ]

8:1 to flop a four-flush, 15-1 to have a flush by the river. The odds are right, I have to admit, even if the LP raise makes some of the limpers re-think their limp, as long as your queen-high flush is good. Against a raise, I'd really like to have more than one way to win, or my one draw to be to the near-nuts (hence the difference if we were talking about A2s), in order to stay in against a passive's raise, that's all.