LAGgin' it up in the $109s

[schwza]

i didn't even notice this till now, but i posted this hand in mtt earlier today. see, i would never try to steal out of the blinds on a 345 flop.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t15 (10 handed) converter

Button (t940)
SB (t940)
Hero (t1000)
UTG (t985)
UTG+1 (t985)
UTG+2 (t1340)
MP1 (t1000)
MP2 (t975)
MP3 (t840)
CO (t995)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, MP1 calls t15, MP2 calls t15, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (t60) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t45</font>,

[Jman28]

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flop: you're not going to fold out any pocket pairs. a7 and below has a double-gutter or better, so they're not going anywhere. bigger Ax might raise, call, or fold. (the possibility that a hand like AT might call is a good reason to bet the turn). flush draws are likely sticking around. i don't think you're winning the pot on the flop enough, so you're committing yourself to firing again on the turn,

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I agree with you. My flop bet probably is a little less break even (really rough estimate).

I am setting up/prepared for a turn bluff here. We are both deep stacked so each bluff carries a lot of leverage behind it.

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interesting hand, just because it made me think about a line that is not in my bag of tricks.

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It's not in mine either yet. Experimenting.

[Jman28]

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On the river you are no good he has a set.

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Wouldn't a set very often raise the flop or turn?

I don't like the river call. I think he has a set and he was afraid you were drawing to an open ended straight or a flush. Although I can't imagine he wouldn't raise your 70 bet with a set. But how could he just call you down if 8s were good? Your turn bet would put him off any flush draw. Maybe he has A5s (or A4s or A3s) but that river bet makes me think he got a lot more comfortable with his hand after the turn and river.

Check raising the flop is more effective in a spot like this I think. When someone voluntarily puts money into the pot, even just limping, they're looking for a reason to stay in. Checkraise will make them fold their garbage, leading the flop may not

I like the second barrel a lot. This type of play works quite well in multitable tourneys as well. How about a weak lead on the river. If u get raised your beat for sure

[durron597]

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On the river you are no good he has a set.

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Wouldn't a set very often raise the flop or turn?

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He might have a straight. Think about common openlimping hands. You are charging a lot of chips on the turn, I don't think he's calling you with just a draw or a hand like A5s. You are beaten on the river most of the time here, and it's by a hand that can beat a jack. I am folding.

[Chaostracize]

I wouldn't have minded the river call if you didn't fire the second barrel. But once you DO fire the second barrel, and you hit your 8, I'm value betting the river and folding to a raise.

[curtains]

Of course I would never play like this in a million years.

[Jman28]

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I wouldn't have minded the river call if you didn't fire the second barrel. But once you DO fire the second barrel, and you hit your 8, I'm value betting the river and folding to a raise.

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I think he has a draw or a hand that spanks my pair of eights. A value bet doesn't accomplish anything really.

What hand do you think he'll call with that I beat? A4 maybe. I think a check-call is better here to catch all the draws. He will bet a missed flush draw a large amount of the time here.

[Unarmed]

I see that flop and my first instinct is to check/call and bluff any of the 3552529 scare cards on the turn. Your first instinct was to represent the weak made hand. Weird, huh. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

If I bet the flop I play it as you did. Whenever I make some whacky bluff on a drawy board and get flat called, I'm normally committed to firing that second (and often third) barrel, unless I'm against an aggro opponent and the turn delivers a card that an overpair would normally be scared of (the J is fine in this case).

Betting the river is obviously bad, for reasons you have already mentioned, and you can fold or call based on your read and his bet size. Note: I call pretty much anything there b/c I'm a calling station. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]