JJ vs 789TT - Page 2

@bsolute_luck · #11 10-02-2005, 08:09 AM

no point in raising. easy call. split with another J, lose to a full house or QJ, beat 2 pair or trip Tens.

radek2166 · #12 10-02-2005, 09:23 AM

How many times have u seen the ass end of the staight raise here? More than you would think.

I just call. Then kick myself in the nuts when I am shown the 56o

tyler_cracker · #13 10-02-2005, 03:38 PM

One of the things i'm finding interesting about these replies is that there aren't any "hard" justifications for calling or raising. No one has tried -- and i haven't seen any way -- to bust out some math on this problem. There's no sensible way (that i see) to assign hand ranges to Villain at this point. So we're stuck playing on feel. I realize this happens; i just find it interesting.

Two things that factored into my decision that no one has mentioned:

1. Villain check-raised rather than donking the river. This suggests a little more strength, does it not?

2. I'm happy to 3-bet, but it would really suck to have it 4-bet back to me, because i still can't fold.

Results:
<font color="white">So, i decided to just call (but felt like a weenie about it). Villain turned over 77 (good call lautzutao!).</font>

#14 10-02-2005, 03:50 PM

I'd call. Hands that beat you are 77,88,QJ,T9. You are not going to fold a Jack. These are all likely hands, I think.

Aaron W. · #15 10-02-2005, 04:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
One of the things i'm finding interesting about these replies is that there aren't any "hard" justifications for calling or raising. No one has tried -- and i haven't seen any way -- to bust out some math on this problem.

[/ QUOTE ]

There isn't much math that can be done unless you can put villain on a sensible range of hands. All we know is that he called preflop, flop, turn, and check-raised the river. About the only thing that is certain is that villain has a very strong hand. All there is an assessment of what villain would check-raise the river with. The only way you 3-bet is if he would check-raise a hand as weak as trip tens. Do you see why?

#16 10-02-2005, 04:23 PM

How is a weak-tight calling that flop (with his holding)?[img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

tyler_cracker · #17 10-03-2005, 12:48 AM

[ QUOTE ]
The only way you 3-bet is if he would check-raise a hand as weak as trip tens. Do you see why?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, and this is the other thing i was going to mention. I should only be reraising if i think i'm ahead 55% of the time when i'm called. Given that i wasn't sure of that, plus the possibility of getting 4-bet, this pushes the decision to a call.

tyler_cracker · #18 10-03-2005, 12:51 AM

[ QUOTE ]
How is a weak-tight calling that flop (with his holding)?[img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

He never had to face more than 1 bet, my table image was probably a little LAGgy given how passive the rest of the table was and how i'd been attacking the maniac, and i guess he was a little looser after the flop.

I was surprised as well when he turned over that 77 though.