Suited Kings Poll

[istewart]

I think it's easy because if the button raised after a bunch of limpers you would clearly call. Here your position relative to the SB when you make a flush sucks but you can protect a pair of kings (or another vulnerable hand) a lot better.

[MN_Mime]

Not closing the action doesn't concern me here.

1) Without reads, only the EP really has a case for LRR.
2) You're only putting in 1 bet to see the flop.
3) If the action continues behind you, how many folds are you going to see? LRR discounts your high card outs but not your flush draw. I'm not sure that seeing a flop after an EP LRR can ever be -EV. You're likely going to close post-flop action after he raises a SB flop stab.

One thing to remember is that you're not facing AKs since you hold the K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], so your flush is unlikely to be dominated by PFR or LRR so you can limit their hands to big pocket pairs and holdings in other suits.

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Being OOP against the PFR is more problematic but not as scary as you feel. Getting caught in multiway betting with any four flush is a GOOD problem and second nuts is a GREAT problem.

The peel scenarios are more situational and will probably depends upon whether the BFD is there or not. Facing a flop bet OOP with a small piece can be tricky. I'd be more inclined to peel (or raise?) hitting the 7 (where I can reverse dominate) than the K.

[sy_or_bust]

I voted for easy calls in both spots. This doesn't mean they are perfect scenarios for K7s. Position relative to SB sucks if he'll bet most flops, and certainly things can still go sour preflop and postflop to cut into your odds. But I suspect none of this matters enough to contemplate a fold in this situation - K7s has way too much value in big, loose-passive pots. I'd call with a lot worse than K7s.

[PokerBob]

I'm calling J7s here, and likely worse.

[PTjvs]

Im not positive that J7s isnt a better HAND here than K7s.

jvs

[onegymrat]

At first, I thought you were talking about K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

[Aces McGee]

Please tell us why. The only way this thread will be useful is if we hear from both sides.

I voted easy calls for both.

-McGee

[private joker]

[ QUOTE ]
Please tell us why. The only way this thread will be useful is if we hear from both sides.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, so far Derek is the only one to do so. I don't want to speak for BoxTree, so I'll let him post his arguments for it being an easy fold.

The reason I think it's a super-easy call have already been stated. You're getting more than enough odds just to flop 2 or more hearts, which you like. Even forgetting about the K or 7, you'll flop the second nut flush draw more than 1/14 times. I like your implied odds here too. I'm not too worried about reverse implied odds because I'd be able to play a K cautiously, getting away from it if the action heats up.

I also wouldn't mind hearing from Ed Miller. BoxTree says Ed would recommend folding, and I say he'd call. Maybe we should PM him...

[BoxTree]

Basically, I fux0red the math. I thought flush draws are flopped 6% of the time and not 11% of the time. That's a big difference.

So, yeah, from now on, this is an easy call. But I won't call 32s as easily as Evan will. Wow, man, wow.

[Ed Miller]

[ QUOTE ]
I also wouldn't mind hearing from Ed Miller. BoxTree says Ed would recommend folding, and I say he'd call. Maybe we should PM him...

[/ QUOTE ]

I call no problem.