NYC poker raid? - Page 12

The Armchair · #**111** 05-28-2005, 04:44 PM

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Interesting. So you could just throw backgammon sets on all the tables and reopen.

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The police do not have to bust a game in progress, they just need an affidavit from witnesses and a court order.

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To do what? If it is to arrest the employees and owners, you are right -- they could just get the witness to sign an affidavit, present that to a magistrate, get a warrant, and go to the named party's houses and arrest them there. No problem.

But if it reopens as a backgammon club, and if backgammon for money is legal, for what would the people be arrested?

Luv2DriveTT · #**112** 05-28-2005, 04:47 PM

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To do what? If it is to arrest the employees and owners, you are right -- they could just get the witness to sign an affidavit, present that to a magistrate, get a warrant, and go to the named party's houses and arrest them there. No problem.

But if it reopens as a backgammon club, and if backgammon for money is legal, for what would the people be arrested?

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The owners are still liable for the club's actions, both current and previous. The players are safe (unless they are fools), but we need to be concerned about the safety of the staff, the owners, and their investment in the club as well or there will never be poker in NYC.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

cardshark · #**113** 05-28-2005, 04:47 PM

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According to a reliable witness, the police knew who all the employees were. Satelliter's risk may continue should he reopen the club for business, as material witnesses may already exist. The police do not have to bust a game in progress, they just need an affidavit from witnesses and a court order.

PS: Please correct me if I am wrong.

TT

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I would say, you are correct, TT.

satelliter · #**114** 05-28-2005, 05:23 PM

We will not reopen as a backgammon club, although we are soon having a tournament.

Backgammon requires more skill than poker (until recently computers were more competitive at chess than backgammon) and poker requires more skill than pinball.

Voltron87 · #**115** 05-28-2005, 05:34 PM

so is anywhere open? ace point? they're badly run enough to do this.

TakeMeToTheRiver · #**116** 05-28-2005, 06:29 PM

You are being way to certain in giving advice about these laws -- most of the definitions have not been tested and you are incorrect about some of the interpretations to the extent they have been tested... be careful acting like a lawyer on the internet (whether you are one or not)...

iceman5 · #**117** 05-28-2005, 06:32 PM

The mere fact of not having ID or refusing to tell them who you are is not illegal so you cant be arrested for it....BUT...they do have the right to detain you long enough for them to figure out who you are. When they finally do figure out who you are, then cant arrest you for the "not IDing yourself". But you could be arrested if you have any outstanding warrants and they might arrest you for gamgling when they wouldnt have in the 1st place if you hadnt made them go thru all the extra work.

Most people who dont carry ID or wont ID themselves when asked have a reason to do that. Usuaully they are wanted for something. If you just forgot your ID, then they can still pull it up on the car computer and usually straighten it out right there.

They cant just say "oh well, we dont know who this guy is because he doesnt have ID, I hope hes not wanted for Murder"..and let you go.

Voltron87 · #**118** 05-28-2005, 06:37 PM

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The mere fact of not having ID or refusing to tell them who you are is not illegal so you cant be arrested for it....BUT...they do have the right to detain you long enough for them to figure out who you are. When they finally do figure out who you are, then cant arrest you for the "not IDing yourself". But you could be arrested if you have any outstanding warrants and they might arrest you for gamgling when they wouldnt have in the 1st place if you hadnt made them go thru all the extra work.

Most people who dont carry ID or wont ID themselves when asked have a reason to do that. Usuaully they are wanted for something. If you just forgot your ID, then they can still pull it up on the car computer and usually straighten it out right there.

They cant just say "oh well, we dont know who this guy is because he doesnt have ID, I hope hes not wanted for Murder"..and let you go.

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So by not giving up ID you're not committing a crime, but they can still check who you are and bring you in to get your identity, but nobody gets charged with "not showing ID to an officer". got it.

other1 · #**119** 05-28-2005, 06:37 PM

The interesting question in my mind is, will these laws, and the 'grey area' now get tested in court and clarified.

My guess is no. I think the dealers all plea down to criminal mischief or something and get parole and I think the owners strike a deal where they pay a big fine and get off.

other1 · #**120** 05-28-2005, 06:39 PM

Before the fact checking police get me.. I meant probation, not parole.