Flat Tax?

[TaintedRogue]

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I believe the closest thing to that might be the Constitution Party.

Also, it does have a definite Christian slant.

http://www.constitutionparty.com/

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Find it hard to have any faith in this party. Take for instance the article on illegal aliens, i.e., placing the blame on Mexico and trying to place the cost on its gov't.

The reason we have illegal aliens is because we have people willing to hire them. Eliminate the Mexicans chance of improving their lifestyle, the same reason we came here, and you'll eliminate the aliens.

So, eliminate the U.S. citizens who are stabbing their fellow countrymen in the back, by hiring mexicans to hand drywall instead of an American.
Take those back stabbing Americans who hire illegals, strip them of their citizenship and ship them back to the country their ancestors came from, and, you'll eliminate illegal aliens.
Place the blame where the blame belongs.

[andyfox]

"it is a convoluted mess."

We all agree on that. I'm in favor of simplifiaction without flatness.

"The man should be put on a raft with limited supplies and towed out to sea, where the Good Lord can determine his fate. If sharks chew off both his arms, then I would consider that a just punishment for his crimes against journalistic integrity."

Two sentences worthy of Twain from our resident curmudgeon. Bravo.


BTW, you no doubt know just how Good I think the Good Lord is. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[ACPlayer]

THat I would ever support robbery. You are in effect calling me a thief. You can attack my argument but please do not, in effect, call me a thief.

[SheetWise]

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THat I would ever support robbery. You are in effect calling me a thief. You can attack my argument but please do not, in effect, call me a thief.

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My apologies.

Correction.

ACPlayer does not support the thieving of money from one group of people for the benefit of another group of people.

He does, however, support the taxing of money from one group of people for the benefit of another group of people.

I can hear the victims breathing a sigh of relief already.

[Cyrus]

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...the taxing of money from one group of people for the benefit of another group of people.

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Alright, please explain why the road built with one person's tax money cannot be used by that person but only by the others, the "freeloaders"? Isn't tax money collected and then dispensed for common benefit (ostensibly) ? It's not only "handouts to welfare crack mothers", y'know.

Your approach is a tad simplistic.

[warlockjd]

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The reason we have illegal aliens is because we have people willing to hire them. Eliminate the Mexicans chance of improving their lifestyle, the same reason we came here, and you'll eliminate the aliens.

So, eliminate the U.S. citizens who are stabbing their fellow countrymen in the back, by hiring mexicans to hand drywall instead of an American.
Take those back stabbing Americans who hire illegals, strip them of their citizenship and ship them back to the country their ancestors came from, and, you'll eliminate illegal aliens.
Place the blame where the blame belongs.


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Sounds like you are advocating socialism

[Lottery Larry]

Other than my understanding, limited as it is, is that there really isn't a good non-partisan study on the full and complete economic effects of a flat tax?

I've always been curious for a solid factual estimate of the changes that could result, hand-in-hand with a detailed factual accounting of the current contributions/costs at different income and occupational levels.
I've dismissed what little I've seen, arguing either side, as too one-sided and potentially "faked" to use as a basis for a solid decision on flat taxes.

I have a few random comments that may or may not apply:

1) Who has the greater benefit, and who should be the focus of income tax legislation benefits- the man who pays 1/10 of another in taxes, or the man who earns 10x than the other?

2) Since legistlation = loopholes (intentional or not), why would a flat tax change anything for long? When top tax rates were 90%, a whole industry grew to hide income.

With current day tax policies, hoards of businesses and people are involved in tax shelters and other giveback programs to make taxes effectively go away for those who can afford the access to that help

If anyone has a pointer to data that isn't polluted by agenda, I'd appreciate the educational assistance.

Thanks
LL

PS- One further question. Is it too simplistic, or maybe pie-in-the-sky, to ask if there should be limits on the accumulation/consolidation of wealth/benefits, when that "wealth" is earned by the efforts of those who don't share equally in that gain?
It probably leads back to the investors vs. employees debate vis-a-vis ROI.

[Lottery Larry]

"approach is a tad simplistic"

That's always been the rub. People don't fully realize the shared benefit and burdent that accrue with various choices for expenditure.

People also don't fully realize that the proponents of one view are rarely clear about their own motives, not to mention personal gain, from espousing a particular platform

[CORed]

While I think a flat tax, simplified progressive tax with moderate maximum rates, or replacing the income tax with a national sales tax with low-income rebate (my favorite, BTW), would be preferable to the mess we have now, I think any tax reform is going to run up against the desire of Congress to tinker with the structure to perform social engineering and give breaks to special interests. It seems that every time Congress sets out to "simplify" the tax code, they make it more complex.

[SheetWise]

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... please explain why the road built with one person's tax money cannot be used by that person but only by the others ...

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Those would be known as user fees, and while they resemble taxes they are for the most part applied evenly -- tax on fuel, excise taxes on tires, auto registration, etc. The goal is to have the people who use it pay for it, and pay for it in some proportion to the degree they use it.

As this is a thread on a "flat tax", it is proposed as an alternative to graduated and progressive taxes. I think user fees should be used wherever and whenever possible. I have no problem with taxes, it's simply that they should be applied evenly. After all, the proposed flat tax is not really flat at all -- it is a proposed flat rate, and has huge exemptions -- which in the end makes it quite progressive.