Have aliens visited earth?

[jason_t]

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Id argue that you missed my point, but im sure youd argue that I missed yours

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Clearly.

[MonkeeMan]

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The monkeys pounding on typewriters thing as a comparison to evolution is horse [censored]. IF the bottom 10% of monkeys that produced the least-like-Shakespearean text were shot, and the remainder allowed to breed to replace em every couple of years, that would be a fair comparison.

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Shootin's to good for the scurvy curs. Make 'em walk the plank, arrrrrr.

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The monkeys pounding on typewriters thing as a comparison to evolution is horse [censored]. IF the bottom 10% of monkeys that produced the least-like-Shakespearean text were shot, and the remainder allowed to breed to replace em every couple of years, that would be a fair comparison.

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Shootin's to good for the scurvy curs. Make 'em walk the plank, arrrrrr.

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Ayyyy! Spoken like a matey who understands the nature of salty seamen! Arr!

An why be it always monkeys 'n' typewriters, me hearty? Why can't it be pussies? They be nicer for work that be needin' delicate fingerin'.... arrr!

[TimM]

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Its like the monkeys pounding on the typewriter thing. If you have enough monkeys randomly punching keys on a typewriter, eventually one of them will punch out the complete works of william shakespear. So even if intelligent life is "OMG so super super rare" The universe is just so big that its going to happen, and more than oce. There are more stars in the universe than there are grains of sand on our ENTIRE planet, thats a whole hell of a lot of chances for life to evolve into intelligence

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This is a bad analogy really.

We are not trying to produce a specific text, just a good enough one.

And we are not working purely randomly.

Just as an example, we know things like eyes evolved independently in many different lineages. So you can't say something like "If that one mutation that led to the eye did not happen, we wouldn't be here" because obviously there are many ways to get to eyes.

So we are not just blundering about the search space hoping to come across the right answer. Evolution is a feedback mechanism that is attracted to good things (like eyes).

[TimM]

jason,

Rather than argue with you, how about a deal? I will read Rare Earth and you can read Darwin's Dangerous Idea by Daniel C. Dennett. It's actually very good and I think you would like it anyway.

[jason_t]

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jason,

Rather than argue with you, how about a deal? I will read Rare Earth and you can read Darwin's Dangerous Idea by Daniel C. Dennett. It's actually very good and I think you would like it anyway.

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Thanks Tim but I've already read that book. If you have another suggestion I'd be happy to take you up on your offer otherwise I could reread it (it's been about 4 years).

[jason_t]

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Its like the monkeys pounding on the typewriter thing. If you have enough monkeys randomly punching keys on a typewriter, eventually one of them will punch out the complete works of william shakespear. So even if intelligent life is "OMG so super super rare" The universe is just so big that its going to happen, and more than oce. There are more stars in the universe than there are grains of sand on our ENTIRE planet, thats a whole hell of a lot of chances for life to evolve into intelligence

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a bad analogy really.

We are not trying to produce a specific text, just a good enough one.

And we are not working purely randomly.

Just as an example, we know things like eyes evolved independently in many different lineages. So you can't say something like "If that one mutation that led to the eye did not happen, we wouldn't be here" because obviously there are many ways to get to eyes.



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Which has happened in (approximately) 15 different ways.

[Alobar]

so I was sitting here reading this very thread and I looked out my window and snapped this pic.....guess now we have proof

[MonkeeMan]

Awesome, he's flashing the intergalactic "we love your kind" sign! (I'm jealous, it's cloudy here)

In the 60s my Gran saw a UFO. It was a metallic spinning top shaped object that had an orange glow coming from inside. This was in broad daylight on a clear day maybe 100m from her.