My questions after 2005

[coffeecrazy1]

I've been thinking about the state of our country, and I honestly don't have the answers to the following questions (from a country point of view):

1)Why was Afghanistan acceptable to attack, but Iraq was not?

2)Are we truly at war?

3)Is the Patriot Act a good thing?

4)Which is more important: our lives, or our freedom to live them the way we choose?

5)Why is Iraq so important?

6)What is our goal?

7)Four years later, have we overreacted to 9/11?

8)Have the lives we've lost in Iraq been less than the lives we've saved in doing so?

9)Is this a temporary state, or a new paradigm of America?

10)Are things better?

I realize that many of these questions are unanswerable. Frankly, I'm just bewildered by what's happening in our country. It would seem that no one remembers we will be electing a new President in two years, and that much of this will change(barring we elect Cheney). I just don't know what's happening. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[twowords]

1)Why was Afghanistan acceptable to attack, but Iraq was not?

More importantly the latter was not in our interests to attack.

2)Are we truly at war?

Not truly, no. Only our volunteer army and their families are sacrificiing. We're not, we even keep our tax cuts. We are at war with al-Queda but thats not an inter-state war and shouldn't be a military-intensive war.

3)Is the Patriot Act a good thing?

Overall who knows, but some parts don't seem too useful. Also, it was created before 911 and passed after, so I wonder if a similar bill taylored to 911 and the actaul threat would be more relavent, then this pre-911 bill that the admnistration had always wanted to pass.

4)Which is more important: our lives, or our freedom to live them the way we choose?

That is merely a false choice this admnistration presents. Accept domestic spying/intrusions or you risk your life. Ugh.

5)Why is Iraq so important?

A very strategic country for many reasons, most importantly oil and its central location in the crucial middle east continent.

6)What is our goal?

A democratic ally to begin turning around/transforming the middle east. This may require a long-term US presence and continuing bloodshed, an Al-Queda recruiters' dream come true.

7)Four years later, have we overreacted to 9/11?

More of a mis-reaction as far as Iraq and a limitless WoT is concerned.

8)Have the lives we've lost in Iraq been less than the lives we've saved in doing so?

Who have we saved from death?

9)Is this a temporary state, or a new paradigm of America?

Hopefully temporary, since even the election of a moderate Republican would improve our foreign policy vastly over Bush I would hope.

10)Are things better?

...than 9/11/01? No.

"I realize that many of these questions are unanswerable."

Well I tried.

9-11 has been great for scaring the masses to keep them in agreement with our murderous, hypocritical foriegn policy.

Its the ultimate excuse.

[BCPVP]

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1)Why was Afghanistan acceptable to attack, but Iraq was not?

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I think both were acceptable so I can't answer this.

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2)Are we truly at war?

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With Iraq? I don't know. I don't think Congress has declared war, so if that's the case then no. But this is pretty close to war, I'd say.

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3)Is the Patriot Act a good thing?

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Probably. Most of what I read seemed to be updating the laws to fit the technology available (cell phones, internet, etc). If it can be shown that it is being used to violate peoples' rights then I think the offending section should be removed.

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4)Which is more important: our lives, or our freedom to live them the way we choose?

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Ben probably knows the answer.

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5)Why is Iraq so important?

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I believe it has to do with Middle East stability. Saddam Hussein was not a very stable force in the region and the Duelfer Report shows that he was working to circumvent the sanctions in order to restart his weapons program. I think by removing him and encouraging a democratic gov't, we can help stabilize the area which is in our interests because we benefit from stability through trade and decreased terrorism. We can already see an impact in that Libya has been scared straight (purportedly; we should still keep a close eye on them) and Egypt and Saudi Arabia are moving towards legitimate elections. Whether it works out in the long run time will tell.

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6)What is our goal?

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See above.

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7)Four years later, have we overreacted to 9/11?

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I think it would be difficult to overreact to a terrorist attack that kills 3,000 people. I think our actions so far have been more or less appropriate. But we definitely could do better.

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8)Have the lives we've lost in Iraq been less than the lives we've saved in doing so?

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I think so, but this is pretty much a guess. If Saddam was allowed to restart his weapons program after the sanctions were lifted I'm sure more than 30,000 would be dead.

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9)Is this a temporary state, or a new paradigm of America?

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Probably a new paradigm. Just as the U.S. was different after Pearl Harbor, so too it is different after 9-11.

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10)Are things better?

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Tough to tell. This may be easier to answer in 2011, once we've had more time to look back.

[Meech]

1) Yes (Err I thought this was a yes/no) Because they were harboring the taliban and somebody's ass needed kicking.
2) No
3) No
4) Second One
5) Unknown
6) Unsure. It's either democracy in the middle east or global domination. Coin toss.
7) Yes
8) Yes
9) It'll swing with the country.
10) Not really.

[tylerdurden]

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Only our volunteer army and their families are sacrificiing. We're not, we even keep our tax cuts.

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You don't think all of the money being spent on this war is detrimental? Couldn't I get an even bigger tax cut without that spending?

[twowords]

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8)Have the lives we've lost in Iraq been less than the lives we've saved in doing so?

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I think so, but this is pretty much a guess. If Saddam was allowed to restart his weapons program after the sanctions were lifted I'm sure more than 30,000 would be dead.


[/ QUOTE ]

Baseless. If Iraq used weapons of mass destruction on anyone, the US would send Iraq to the stone age and Saddam's regime with it. Making this policy known, which we failed to do in 1991 (unless you truly think Saddam would attack Kuwait if he thought the US would intervene), would deter him from agressive action.

The CIA report a few months before the war stated the the probability of Iraq using its weapons of mass destruction was very low, unless its regime was threatened.

So again, who are these people who would be dead if not for the US invasion?

[CORed]

1)Why was Afghanistan acceptable to attack, but Iraq was not?
Afghanistan harbaored and aided the terrorists who planned the 9/11 attacks. Iraq did not. More important, invading Iraq got us into a no-win quagmire and is tying up vital military resources that may be needed elsewhere.
2)Are we truly at war?
Practically, yes, We have troops in a foriegn country, shooting at people and being shot at. Legally, no.
3)Is the Patriot Act a good thing?
Some provisions (attaching wiretap warrants to people rather than specific phones) may be useful. Other parts (allowing snooping into people's reading habits for one) are unnecessary and intrusive.
4)Which is more important: our lives, or our freedom to live them the way we choose?
Both are equally important. However, the notion that we must sacrifice our freedom to save our lives is utter nonsense.
5)Why is Iraq so important?
Oil, strategic location.
6)What is our goal?
To esablish a stable, friendly, democratic government. Unfortunately, it may not be achievable, and almost certainly not achievable under current policies.
7)Four years later, have we overreacted to 9/11?
Over-reacted, and reacted incorrectly.
8)Have the lives we've lost in Iraq been less than the lives we've saved in doing so?
I'm not conviced that we've saved any lives in our Iraqi venture, and may even have cost lives in adition to those lost in the actual conflict.
9)Is this a temporary state, or a new paradigm of America?
A temporary state is my fondest hope. A new paradigm my worst fear.
10)Are things better?
No, and it's not close.
[ QUOTE ]
I realize that many of these questions are unanswerable. Frankly, I'm just bewildered by what's happening in our country. It would seem that no one remembers we will be electing a new President in two years, and that much of this will change(barring we elect Cheney). I just don't know what's happening. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I think there is a significant probability that we will never have another presidential election. I hope I'm wrong.

[coffeecrazy1]

[ QUOTE ]
I think there is a significant probability that we will never have another presidential election. I hope I'm wrong.

[/ QUOTE ] That's a patently terrifying, and seemingly hysterical, thought. I'm not dismissing it out of hand, but where did you get this idea?

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I think there is a significant probability that we will never have another presidential election. I hope I'm wrong.

[/ QUOTE ] That's a patently terrifying, and seemingly hysterical, thought. I'm not dismissing it out of hand, but where did you get this idea?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd argue that we havent had a democratic election in a long time.