Couple questions about Christianity

[Peter666]

Catholics believe that every dogma and doctrine comes from what is called the deposit of faith. This means that everything essential regarding our religion was taught by Christ during his ministry and left to the Apostles. When dogmas or doctrines are formed, these are not new concepts being revealed. They are simply a clarification of what Christ taught. So throughout history when certain issues came into dispute, or new issues arose, the Church would provide the final answer by formulating a dogma, and this answer is guaranteed to be true through the intercession of the Holy Ghost. These are said to be defined or de fide statements, and to oppose or question them is to be a heretic.

[vulturesrow]

The Church teaching doesnt state that un baptized children go to heaven. It only says that we can only entrust them to God's care. It makes no statements on their actual status. It almost seems as if you are inventing a conflict where there is none.

[Peter666]

"It only says that we can only entrust them to God's care."

No, it says much more than that. You cannot deny it because the exact quote is directly above. It explicitly states that we can hope for the salvation of unbaptized children. NO WE CAN'T.

[whiskeytown]

I feel it is my duty to inform that these beliefs are more Catholic then Christian and the vast majority of Protestant demoninations don't believe in purgatory - soulsleeping is another matter, but there isn't a single case in the OT or NT for a Purgatory.

RB

[Lestat]

<font color="blue"> Heaven was not open until the Ressurection of Christ. </font>

Then why was it created before Christ?

Most Protestant denominations that I know of would hold the view that nobody is sent to heaven or hell until Jesus returns, and the final Judgement takes place. It's not real clear "where" they are until then. Abraham's bosom? Purgatory? A lower-level of heaven? I've heard lots of different ideas.

Christians can't even agree on what "hell" is, much less who goes, when, and how.

[DavidL]

Re heaven and hell, search for my post under the recent topic "A bizarre twist on morality (abortion)".

David

Its been a while for me on Christian Theology, but I'll chime in on this one. Its a good question and one that challenges the fairness and rationality of the theology behind how people are judged.
The key phrase to look for in theology is "Dispensation Theory".
On the question of whether people who don't have a chance to accept Christ automatically go to heaven - my understanding was that the answer to that is no. An automatic pass into heaven if you've never heard of Christ makes no sense at all as you have pointed out. According to the theology that I am familiar with, how they are judged depends on when they lived and what circumstances they were in. If they lived before Moses' Laws, then they are in the so called "Dispensation of Concience". The same criteria goes for non-Jewish people (called Gentiles by Paul)who have never heard about Christ Here's a quote ...
Romans 2:14-15, " For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,"
Now if you are Jewish before Christ - then you are under the Mosaic Law (Dispensation of Law).
And there are other dispensations that cover other categories.
Now I am not sure how widely dispensation theory is accepted by different denominations - which ones believe it or which get outraged by it.
I've never been a fan of the tendancy of some denominations to emphasise converting people and crusading above all else. So I've asked these kinds of questions too.

[NotReady]

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1. Before Jesus, were all people sent to Heaven? Or were they all sent to Hell?


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There are no specifics laid out in the Bible about this. Paul, in Romans, states that Abraham is the example for all because he "believed God and it was counted to him for righteousness". Obviously, he didn't have faith in Jesus Christ as we know Him, as He hadn't been born yet. Paul also talks about how God reveals Himself to all people, though he doesn't tie this in specifically to Christ. So orthodox Christianity usually says that God saves those who have faith in Him without trying to lay down a set of rules for those who haven't heard of Christ.

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If this is the case, then how do missionaries justify doing what they do?


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I don't believe anyone thinks that someone will be lost after hearing the gospel who would otherwise have been saved had they not heard. Jesus told His disciples to go to all the world and preach the gospel, so it's not correct to say this causes people to be lost.

[MaxPowerPoker]

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1. Before Jesus, were all people sent to Heaven?

[/ QUOTE ]

No.

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Or were they all sent to Hell?

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No.

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If they were all sent to Heaven, then why would God send Jesus down? Why create this opportunity for people to go to Hell? Also, if they were all sent to Heaven, then who if not humans were in Hell before Jesus?

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Justification is where God declares that the righteous requirements of the law are satisfied for sinners on the basis of the righteousness of Jesus Christ. All who believe in Jesus have their sins imputed to Christ (they are crucified with him) and his righteousness is imputed to the believer. Our faith is counted as righteousness. Those in the Old Testament who beleive the promises of God had their faith counted as righteousness as well (Hebrews 11).

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2. I was always told by my Christian friends that those who did not have an opportunity to find out about Christianity and therefore can't accept Jesus (such as indigenous peoples in remote areas) are given the benefit of the doubt and get to go to heaven.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is simply not true. Romans 1 details the guilt of all of creation:

(Rom 1:18) For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.

(Rom 1:19) For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.

(Rom 1:20) For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

Creation reveals certain things about God (his eternal power and divine nature) so that we are all without excuse. So when someone who has not heard the gospel dies and goes to hell, they are going to hell because they are guilty. Also in Romans 10 it says this:

(Rom 10:13) For "everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

(Rom 10:14) But how are they to call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching?

(Rom 10:15) And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, "How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!"

While creation reveals truths about God that leave us without excuse, the gospel alone is the power of God for salvation to all who believe.