I hate these hands...PP 15/30

[TJD]

These are always difficult situations but the problem with checking behind is that you lose a BB against JJ, TT, 88 who may call you down. Since this player is good, he is less likely to have peeled on the flop, but even so, would taking one off with AQ or AJ be that bad? He might just do it to see what you do on the turn. If you check you are making a FTOP mistake here. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

It is true that you are probably not giving him many free outs if you are ahead and also true that you would very much like to NOT be checkraised if he has a K.

Knowing the player is very useful here. As others have pointed out, versus the "default" player it is probably not far from neutral EV to call a CR here.

If this player is not tricky then betting and folding to a CR is the best play.

If he has a bit of chicanery then the small EV you lose from being CR is more than compensated for by the times you get a call with a weaker hand.

I agree it is ugh! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Trevor

[flawless_victory]

[ QUOTE ]
If you check you are making a FTOP mistake here. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]


[/ QUOTE ]OMG OMG NOOOOO! NOT A FTOP MISTAKE!
seriously, i dont get the obsession most of this board has with this... maybe i dont know how to play limit.

[TJD]

Flawless_victory,

I have read a lot of your posts and you quite obviously DO know how to play limit. It seems clear to me that your experience is far greater than mine.

Presumably this means that there is something wrong with MY analysis that failing to bet when you have the best hand is a mistake.

Now, I know that by giving him a free card with his Ace, we may induce a bluff and that may be worth the risk if we can be sure he will bluff the river often enough. However, as I understand it, giving the free card would be a FTOP error according to the definition.

In ALL games we sometimes go against what is "correct" in theory for tactical reasons. Inducing a bluff (on the "given" that he has AJ or AQ) would be to accept that we were breaking FTOP in order to get what we think will be a better return. That would be a reasonable decision if we thought the circumstances were right.

Could you explain your reaction to me? I just don't get it the outburst [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I must be missing something. It would be appreciated. I am new to the board and do not wish to cause offence.

Trevor

[LA_Price]

I don't play much limit anymore but I usually check the turn here and call a river bet. If my pair is lower I usually bet the turn.