KK on this turn - Page 2

Wired Jokers · #1 08-19-2005, 11:06 PM

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You are almost certainly beat here. Your only GUARANTEED out is the Ace of spades, otherwise, if any other spade falls, anybody holding the Ace(spades)-rag has you beat.

Also, because your playing with many opponents, your drawing hard against anybody with a 4 or 9.

I think this a check/fold. Though you need to protect your hand, it's going to be hard to protect it when nobody's bet yet, when the turn hurt you, when the pot is only moderately big, and because you can still get raised by the people still left in the pot.

Check, fold to a bet.

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This post made me want to vomit.

Bet.

sfer · #2 08-19-2005, 01:41 PM

Pot is big, bet.

SnglMaltScotch · #3 08-19-2005, 01:42 PM

I would continue to bet on the turn and call a c/r.

I have trouble putting the button/SB on a 9 or a 4 since they called a 3bet pre-flop. MP1 worries me a bit

I would think that a lot of the time a flush would bet fearing the scare card would slow you down.

You have good outs to a K-high flush on the river.

I would have expected a raise from trips on the flop.

The pot is pretty big so I can't really fold to a c/r with good outs.

I would put a note on MP2 to isolate him pretty frequently since he seems to fold pretty easily after the 3 bet. Folds for one bet closing the action in a huge pot getting 16-1.

Whatcha you think.

DawnToDusk · #4 08-19-2005, 01:44 PM

Tough hand. You say both villians are semi-loose and semi-aggressive, but it seems they are playing this hand pretty passively. It seems to me that they are behind and am still waiting for their card to complete their hand or they are waiting to trap you with a check raise.

You have position so why don't you check here. I mean I hate to give a free card in this position, but if they are still drawing, there is no way to get them to fold for one more BB in a 10BB pot. If the river is a safe card and they check around to you, then you can value bet it knowing your probably ahead.

I think a lot of people are gonna say bet in this position but whats it gonna do? If you are beaten you will get check raised here. You will then have a draw to the second nuts, but you could still be behind with someone to the nuts. It seems silly to me to find out "where you are at" on such coordinated boards, especially when you know your opponents are loose.

chief444 · #5 08-19-2005, 02:22 PM

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I think a lot of people are gonna say bet in this position but whats it gonna do?

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What betting often does...win you money.

peterchi · #6 08-19-2005, 01:46 PM

**Warning: I'm about to say a lot of stuff I'm unsure about.

Does this fall under checking-behind with outs?

I'm thinking, if we're not already behind, your opponents probably don't have that many outs, so a free card wouldn't be the end of the world. **although this may very well be the dumbest part of my post.

If we are behind, paying 2 bets to see the river would kinda suck.

I'd check. But I'm so not sure. The main thing concerning me about this is that the pot is already pretty big.

meep_42 · #7 08-19-2005, 01:54 PM

Any spade that your ahead of will call, any pair will call.

You have the best hand here FREQUENTLY, if not, you're not getting check-raised by 2-pair here much, and you have up to 15 outs against 2-pair. You have 9 outs against a made straight. You have an overpair, your opponents have shown NO strength. Why oh why would you let them draw to a 4-9 outer for free?

-d

peterchi · #8 08-19-2005, 02:03 PM

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you're not getting check-raised by 2-pair here much

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I think this is a very good point that I overlooked.

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Why oh why would you let them draw to a 4-9 outer for free?

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Because I'm a dummy.

This is why I'm not playing 5/10 with you anymore. That, and I had to take out half of my bankroll because I overspent this summer.

meep_42 · #9 08-19-2005, 02:08 PM

Playing 5/10 with me is the best way to rebuild your bankroll, actually. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

-d

QTip · #10 08-19-2005, 02:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Any spade that your ahead of will call, any pair will call.

You have the best hand here FREQUENTLY, if not, you're not getting check-raised by 2-pair here much, and you have up to 15 outs against 2-pair. You have 9 outs against a made straight. You have an overpair, your opponents have shown NO strength. Why oh why would you let them draw to a 4-9 outer for free?

-d

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[img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] All this makes sense. I think my current downswing is starting to affect my thinking. I checked. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]