Laying down the nuts...?

[ThingDo]

This is ridiculous... unless you put him on EXACTLY KQc ... whatever this is ridiculous

[SlyAK]

I think he might make this bet with a set... maybe AA... he doesnt want a flush draw hanging around, and he doesnt want someone with a hand like AQ hanging around to catch a miracle straight. Just a guess, I am very interested in what he had.

His bet is still overkill in any case.

Sly

[SlyAK]

There is exactly ONE TIME I would fold this.... and that is if he flipped over the K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and I SAW that he had the made straight and he was free-rolling to the flush. I think calling there would be -EV since you can only split and never win and you haven't lost much by folding. Other than that rare circumstance its a clear call.

Sly

[SpaceAce]

I will assume the thread title is a joke because laying this hand down is not even remotely an option unless you can see Kc Qc in your opponent's hand. You aren't seriously giving so much as one second's consideration to folding here, right? Unless this is your last $2,000 on earth (in which case you shouldn't be playing poker with it), you cannot fold.

SpaceAce

[arkose]

if you even consider folding, past the 1.5 sec it takes to double check the flop for a 3 flush (and with a 2k bet, you will do a double check), then you shouldn't be playing no limit for these stakes......you have the nuts, push...excluding KQc, the very best he can do is win ~36% of the time

in fact, if i am the villain, and it takes you longer than 5 seconds to think, and then i see your cards after u call, i would be pissed that you made me sweat it out for even that long

[GimmeDaWatch]

Why on earth would our villain play KQ clubs that way in the first place? If he did, I would stop playing with him as he is psychic or is cheating.

[arkose]

exactly, thats why its a no brainer situation [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[DCIAce]

[ QUOTE ]
in fact, if i am the villain, and it takes you longer than 5 seconds to think, and then i see your cards after u call, i would be pissed that you made me sweat it out for even that long

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. First thing I thought about after I saw "had to sit and think it out for a bit" was that the villain is going to be *pissed* when he proudly flips over his AA and sees the nuts being slowrolled like that.

It's a call and it's not remotely close. If this were PLO, you might have a case for folding. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[coltrane]

while it's easy to shrug off what you are alluding to, I can sort of see your point......a very good player is making a ridiculous overbet on the flop and playing the hand in such a way that he knows you CAN'T make a mistake - so why would he do that?......you haven't said how well he knows your tendencies, but even he has three aces, he might know that you aren't going to call that bet without anything but KQ.......which means he wouldn't make that bet without KQ.....but then the question is, if he does have KQ:
a) does that definitely mean they're both clubs
b) does he really KNOW you also have KQ - because if he's got the nuts, wouldn't he want to try to make some money off a set/two pair/etc.?

he could certainly be weary that scare cards might come out anyway, so he wants to put the question to you now.....and there's certainly a chance he could also have KQ and you chop.......but to think that he's got exactly KcQc and consider it probable enough to lay down the nuts has got to be -EV here.......perhaps someone can do the math....

[daryn]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
while it's easy to shrug off what you are alluding to, I can sort of see your point......a very good player is making a ridiculous overbet on the flop and playing the hand in such a way that he knows you CAN'T make a mistake - so why would he do that?......you haven't said how well he knows your tendencies, but even he has three aces, he might know that you aren't going to call that bet without anything but KQ.......which means he wouldn't make that bet without KQ.....but then the question is, if he does have KQ:
a) does that definitely mean they're both clubs
b) does he really KNOW you also have KQ - because if he's got the nuts, wouldn't he want to try to make some money off a set/two pair/etc.?

he could certainly be weary that scare cards might come out anyway, so he wants to put the question to you now.....and there's certainly a chance he could also have KQ and you chop.......but to think that he's got exactly KcQc and consider it probable enough to lay down the nuts has got to be -EV here.......perhaps someone can do the math....

[/ QUOTE ]



c) are you thinking too much?

yes.