A question for Christians AND atheists

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If anyone could ever off me logical reason to return to faith

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Because life without afterlife is awfully pointless.

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I don't see the logic in your answer, Riddick. Why do things have to have a meaning??? Because it values you more? Anyway there is absolutely no reasons for things needing to have meaning; to say the contrary is a non-rational prejudice.

[hmkpoker]

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Because life without afterlife is awfully pointless.

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Please elaborate.

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Because life without afterlife is awfully pointless.

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Please elaborate.

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Otiose, senseless, purposeless. Anything that I do that contains any purpose (including such things as investing, studying, working out) is done in context of the future.

Would you go to work on Monday if you knew you were not going to get a paycheck on Friday? Would you make personal plans for a month from now if you knew you were going to die tomorrow?

I a) try to do the right things, and b) drink a cup of wine and eat a loaf of bread the first Sunday of each month in preparation for my inevitable death, hopefully many decades from now.

[imported_luckyme]

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Would you go to work on Monday if you knew you were not going to get a paycheck on Friday? Would you make personal plans for a month from now if you knew you were going to die tomorrow?

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The problem with believing that everyone has that psychological need is that there are millions of two-legged pieces of evidence that show it is not a necessary condition for everyone. Productive, happy, community-oriented, family-centered, whatever ... find life very rewarding and fullfilling without it.
I'm not plugging which is better ( feeling fulfilled because of distant future rewards, or feeling fulfilled with the rewards over 3score and 10) just that it's obviously not a universal necessity.

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I a) try to do the right things, and b) drink a cup of wine and eat a loaf of bread the first Sunday of each month in preparation for my inevitable death, hopefully many decades from now.

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Hiya Riddick,

Regarding your point a) and b):

a) most commendable assuredly, I am just hoping you are not misguided as to what is good (example of monstruous misguidedness: the behaviour you attribute to your god)

b) now, here I must be missing something, I would appreciate your elaboration on how a piece of bread and a cup of wine, the first sunday of each month, prepares you for your inevitable death. By the way, I try to drink a bottle wine everyday and and eat bread 3 or 4 days per week. Will this be helpful to?

[hmkpoker]

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Anything that I do that contains any purpose (including such things as investing, studying, working out) is done in context of the future.

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What about things that are...you know...fun? Fun things have a purpose: a very simple purpose.

I like eating out, going to parties, playing videogames, swimming, surfing, dancing, meditation, painting, making love, playing music and the occasional entheogenic experience for no reason other than the fact that I enjoy doing them. Life is full of enjoyable things.

[ep510]

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Because life without afterlife is awfully pointless.

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Please elaborate.

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Otiose, senseless, purposeless. Anything that I do that contains any purpose (including such things as investing, studying, working out) is done in context of the future.

Would you go to work on Monday if you knew you were not going to get a paycheck on Friday? Would you make personal plans for a month from now if you knew you were going to die tomorrow?

I a) try to do the right things, and b) drink a cup of wine and eat a loaf of bread the first Sunday of each month in preparation for my inevitable death, hopefully many decades from now.

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I think your point confirms the atheistic point of view of why religion is a crutch. You're arguing that without a point, everyone should basically off themselves. And I'd agree that many people would do just that without religion. Which is why, from the atheist's view, religion is, to a degree, necessary yet untrue.

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Because life without afterlife is awfully pointless.

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Why are you so sure life has a point? Nothing about it makes much sense. Look at one aspect of it: the self. There is rationality and there is irrationality. All religion focuses only on the former and ignores the latter or calls it "evil." But why would God give us this "evil" aspect? Why the desires for power and sex, greed and lust, and all these other unspeakables which never cease bubbling inside of us? This is man, honestly. If we are made in the image of God, what kind of monster must God be? Our rationality is by no means our foremost means of action. We act in ways that make no sense, and so does the world. That's why trying to make sense of it never amounts to a sensible answer. I'm not asking you to like it, just to accept it.

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Why are you so sure life has a point? Nothing about it makes much sense. Look at one aspect of it: the self. There is rationality and there is irrationality. All religion focuses only on the former and ignores the latter or calls it "evil." But why would God give us this "evil" aspect? Why the desires for power and sex, greed and lust, and all these other unspeakables which never cease bubbling inside of us? This is man, honestly. If we are made in the image of God, what kind of monster must God be? Our rationality is by no means our foremost means of action. We act in ways that make no sense, and so does the world. That's why trying to make sense of it never amounts to a sensible answer. I'm not asking you to like it, just to accept it.


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Briefly...

Animals murder, steal, "rape", kill their own, and yet they are rational, because to not do so would threaten their survival, which is their only "meaning". Clearly humans descend from the animal order, yet clearly we are no longer animals. Yet the objectivist or the "realist" view denies this and purports, basically, that we are animals. That I do not like nor accept.

"Animals murder, steal, "rape", kill their own, and yet they are rational, because to not do so would threaten their survival, which is their only "meaning". Clearly humans descend from the animal order, yet clearly we are no longer animals. Yet the objectivist or the "realist" view denies this and purports, basically, that we are animals. That I do not like nor accept."

Then how do you explain this obviously apparent behavior in humans? Why would God give us such qualities if they are only conducive to evil?