Great example of why to raise KJs preflop in MP...

[frank_iii]

Paradise Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, CO folds, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB calls, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, MP2 calls.

Turn: (8 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, Hero calls, SB calls.

River: (11 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB calls, MP2 calls.

Final Pot: 17 BB
<font color="green">Main Pot: 17 BB, between MP2, Hero and SB.</font> &gt; <font color="white">Pot won by Hero (17 BB).</font>

Results in white below: <font color="white">
SB has 9d 5h (one pair, nines).
MP2 has Ah Td (one pair, tens).
Hero has Js Ks (straight, king high).
Outcome: Hero wins 17 BB. </font>

The large pot from the preflop raise gave me the implied pot odds to make the call at the end. I never would have made that play (or the flop raise) before reading this forum.

[Yerma]

Um...this is a good example of why you would have been better off calling preflop so that you could just let go on the flop...you realize your flop situation isn't that good?

[frank_iii]

I disagree on both counts. With many loose passive limpers already committed, the raise was intended to increase the pot while I probably held the best hand.

Then, once the flop came, the pot was large so, in order to fight to take it, the raise was intended to limit the field to strengthen my overcard outs with the outside shot at a backdoor straight.

I believe this is exactly what Ed Miller was referring to in "the post":

Why you guys aren't crushing these Microlimit games...

Then again, I could just be a lag.

[Toe Jam]

But you didnt have the best hand. You had absolutely nothing until the river.

[zuluking]

[ QUOTE ]
Um...this is a good example of why you would have been better off calling preflop so that you could just let go on the flop...you realize your flop situation isn't that good?

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, raising pre-flop from MP, especially MP3 with KJ suited is the proper play against a loose LLHE table.

[Yerma]

Oh, I think you played it right...that's not what I mean.

You fell into a bad situation on the flop and because the pot was built you had no choice but to fight for it.

But if it happened this way *every* time, you wouldn't want to raise preflop. In fact, you wouldn't want to see the flop. So this is a terrible example of what you're talking about.

[frank_iii]

So you disagree with SSHE? Even the tight hand chart recommends raising preflop with KJs in middle position.

[frank_iii]

[ QUOTE ]
But you didnt have the best hand. You had absolutely nothing until the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

Preflop, I felt there was a good chance that I held the best hand. Even if I didn't, with the passive table, I felt it was strong enough to push them around post flop.

[afs]

[ QUOTE ]
So you disagree with SSHE? Even the tight hand chart recommends raising preflop with KJs in middle position.

[/ QUOTE ]

the raise is fine. but if yr opponents holdings &amp; the flop were _typical_, this hand'd be a great advertisement against ssh. you played it fine, but also got very lucky. Or rather -- had you known yr opponents actual hands you would have played very poorly. Knowing only the likely hands, you played just fine.

[Yerma]

For god's sake man...read what I write!

You played the hand right.

You flopped bad.

You entitled your post "Great example of why to raise KJs preflop in MP..." but:

Your play was right...SSHE is right...your flop was bad...your example is not a "great example"...it's a "terrible example."