A 15 minute penalty? HELL NO. - Page 2

Black Aces 518 · #11 03-18-2005, 06:52 PM

Anybody who bitches, moans, or freaking threatens someone b/c they don't win the pot when they didn't have the best hand is a grade-A douche.

AviD · #12 03-18-2005, 07:41 PM

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Learn your lesson and stay out of the way when you aren't involved in the hand. Let the dealer and floor do their job.

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Ok, next time you table your hand and the dealer shoves the pot to the other guy, I will wait until the next hand to tell you that both you and the dealer misread your hand and you should have won the pot.

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You can be sure to tell me, and you can also be sure that I'll already know...because I don't let go of my hand until I am POSITIVE I did not win the hand. Anything else, and you deserve to lose the hand.

AviD · #13 03-18-2005, 07:46 PM

While I do not disagree (no one can) with the cards speaking for themselves, I refuse to get involved in a hand I am not part of. Perhaps between the constant bickering that goes on at the live games I participate in or perhaps from the experience I detailed in my other post...but I'd just rather not get involved.

Its not a matter of "what happens outside the casino", its more so my enjoyment of the game. I'm not there to ensure anyone else wins but myself. Lets the cards speak for themselves, and the players involved too. I'm not there to make sure you or anyone else wins a hand they couldn't read themselves...the dealer is, and the floor behind them.

That's just my .02. And no, I'm not saying the "loser" should get the pot, I'm just saying the winner should ensure they get the pot.

cockpit · #14 03-18-2005, 08:27 PM

Clearly the orignal rulings were wrong. That's why the supervisor overruled. You did the right thing.

Jeffage · #15 03-18-2005, 08:40 PM

What about this situation? I was playing 30-60 and not involved in this hand. On the end, the board was Q-3-3-K-4. An older lady checked, her opponent bet and she called. Her opponent tabled QJ. The woman picked her cards up and held Q7 (it should have been a split, but she misread the board and thought she was outkicked). Me and the guy next to me saw her hand clearly. She mucked it. As the dealer shoved the whole pot to her opponent, he said to her (and she was obv. a regular), you should have turned your hand up, any queen chopped. And she freaked. I opened, she said angerly. Bitching and complaining...she NEVER tabled her hand, just looked at it. The guy ended up giving her half the pot w/o the floor being involved.

I tell you what, if that was me, I would give her ABSOLUTELY NOTHING no matter what and I would make a heck of a stink if management demanded I split the pot (which I doubt they'd do, but who knows). If she can't read the board, that's her problem and her loss. If she turned the cards face up, I would have been the first to tell the dealer the pot should be split. That dealer was very talented, but I was tempted to stiff him every time after I saw that.

Jeff

Al_Capone_Junior · #16 03-19-2005, 01:19 AM

Well once the cards are up, cards speak, period. If the dealer mis-reads the cards, and a player points out the error, big hairy deal, cards still speak.

Of course it's quite the grey area if his cards had already hit the muck. Is there any casino anywhere that doesn't have every single person trying to find every single shade of grey that exists with every single rule? I decline further comment, as I think I have just said it all.

Giving you a penalty is ridiculous. I am glad the supervisor over-ruled.

al

chesspain · #17 03-19-2005, 02:32 AM

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When I first started playing, I got chastized for doing the same thing in a 2/4 game, the guy acted like we were playing 200/400 and even remarked about how "grave" my comment could become in higher limit games. I was in a word, shocked, and have never said a word since in any such hand...and I've witnessed quite a few folded winners since then.

Learn your lesson and stay out of the way when you aren't involved in the hand. Let the dealer and floor do their job.

That's my take at least, based on the lesson I learned some time ago.

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The only lesson you learned is that you allowed some douchebag nit to scare you into not upholding the integrity of the game.

AviD · #18 03-19-2005, 08:17 PM

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When I first started playing, I got chastized for doing the same thing in a 2/4 game, the guy acted like we were playing 200/400 and even remarked about how "grave" my comment could become in higher limit games. I was in a word, shocked, and have never said a word since in any such hand...and I've witnessed quite a few folded winners since then.

Learn your lesson and stay out of the way when you aren't involved in the hand. Let the dealer and floor do their job.

That's my take at least, based on the lesson I learned some time ago.

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The only lesson you learned is that you allowed some douchebag nit to scare you into not upholding the integrity of the game.

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First of all, the guy was like 80...so he didn't scare me out of anything. Of course, he may know Kung-Fu and then I would have been in some serious trouble as he weilded that cane around...but I wasn't too worried.

The lesson I learned was that I will only get involved in a hand when I am holding cards. Ensuring the "integrity" of the game, which btw has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the original thread, is not my responsbility in a casino managed poker room.

Furthermore, I don't fear the integrity of the game is compromised because someone misread, folded, or otherwise didn't protect the winning chances (not integrity) of THEIR hand. Why do YOU feel it is every player's responsibility to jump out of their seat to announce the winner of a hand or to correct another player's mistakes? If that's the case, why not help them correct all of their mistakes in playing?

Nevertheless, in regards to the original thread's example, I can see getting involved when floor comes over and inquires, but I can't see intentionally involving yourself in a hand in which you aren't even holding cards.

slickpoppa · #19 03-19-2005, 08:27 PM

You deserve a 15 minute penalty for playing poker on Spring Break

mblax10 · #20 03-19-2005, 10:15 PM

I'm interested what more people think should be done in Jeffage's story. Your not involved in a hand and you're about to see the guy next to you muck the winner.

I saw a similar situation happen a few weeks ago at 10-20. On the river the nuts are on the board, A K Q J T no suits. One player bets the river and a very fishy opponent starts shaking his head and says "I don't have anything." Before he can muck his hand the player next to me, who was not involved in the hand yells at him "You have the nuts!! The nuts are on the board!!" Fish looks again, calls and they split the pot.

If I'm the better on the river I'm very unhappy the other guy opened his mouth while not involved in the hand. I've always felt, if I'm not in a hand I'm not saying a thing. Unless it's the usual casual conversation with my neighbors.