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#1
12-31-2004, 04:19 AM
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Playing against a 80% VPIP 30% PFR jackal?
So i rounded up a bit, but these stats are pretty close against a few of the types of crazies i've found myself up against in the past few weeks, and i'm at a loss for how to play these guys, other than flopping quads or a str8 flush.
I've been in some pots with these guys who try to win every single pot and call despite the horrendous odds (and often with some horrendous cards in the case of some flush draw chases). How the hell do you play against someone like this, knowing that there is NO amount of $$$ that will get them to fold? I've been losing my stacks a lot lately trying to protect my hand from them improving to something better, but it's just not working. I've been reading all my books over again, but many of these assume you're playing against a rational opponent, which almost none of these are. Any thoughts other than folding everything until you get AA and hit a set or a FH with it (or better)? 
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#2
12-31-2004, 04:23 AM
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Re: Playing against a 80% VPIP 30% PFR jackal?
[ QUOTE ]
Any thoughts other than folding everything until you get AA and hit a set or a FH with it (or better)? [/ QUOTE ] If I knew you would do that I'd be at 80%vpip and 30%pfr too. Just push harder with hands than you would against a normal person. Against guys like these I've gone all in with like AQ preflop and been called by like KQ and AJ and other crap. Very Fun.
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#3
12-31-2004, 04:29 AM
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Re: Playing against a 80% VPIP 30% PFR jackal?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Any thoughts other than folding everything until you get AA and hit a set or a FH with it (or better)? [/ QUOTE ] If I knew you would do that I'd be at 80%vpip and 30%pfr too. Just push harder with hands than you would against a normal person. Against guys like these I've gone all in with like AQ preflop and been called by like KQ and AJ and other crap. Very Fun. [/ QUOTE ] I tried a little technique i read in Harrington's book where u limp in from EP and if any action happens, pop a big raise when it comes back around to you. I popped an all in raise and i got called by K7o... and he hit a f'ing str8. Stuff like this is happening on a regular basis to me, and i want to pull my hair out.
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#4
12-31-2004, 07:36 AM
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Re: Playing against a 80% VPIP 30% PFR jackal?
[ QUOTE ]
got called by K7o... and he hit a f'ing str8. Stuff like this is happening on a regular basis to me, and i want to pull my hair out. [/ QUOTE ] That is too funny. Thanks for the good laugh. Sorry about your luck though. Just laughing because I identify. I was actually doing this tonight. The 80 % VPIP and 30 % pfr thing. It worked quite well and I made about $100 tonight on the $25 tables. You might try it and if you do, you can probably figure out how to beat someone doing the same thing. A simple reraise preflop and automatic 3/4 pot bet on the flop is what I would do against me. I wouldn't reraise all-in but I would reraise maybe 3x what the maniac raised.
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#5
12-31-2004, 11:01 AM
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Re: Playing against a 80% VPIP 30% PFR jackal?
[ QUOTE ]
It worked quite well and I made about $100 tonight on the $25 tables. You might try it and if you do, you can probably figure out how to beat someone doing the same thing. [/ QUOTE ] I've tried it, it doesn't work for me. Too many ppl will call with anything for it to work, and someone is always hitting something better.
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#7
12-31-2004, 03:17 PM
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Re: Playing against a 80% VPIP 30% PFR jackal?
Play PREMIUM starters and bet the hell out of them. Raise, ReRaise, ReReRaise. If you've got PREMIUM cards hammer these maniacs. If you do get AA or KK limp re-raise all in and watch the jackal defend his manhood by calling. See the article on internet NL in this month's magazine for why this is a good play (Wayfare - great article by the way).
Understand that hands that are "WAY AHEAD" preflop are probably only 3:1 or 4:1 favorites which means that OVER YOUR ENTIRE POKER LIFE 1 time in 5 you'll get outdrawn. That doesn't mean that every 5th time in a given night you'll get outdrawn. It could happen 10 times in a row and just because it happened 10 times in a row doesn't mean its less likely to happen next time. If you can't handle the swings, play limit. Play Well! [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]The Ugly One! [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]
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#8
12-31-2004, 03:27 PM
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Re: Playing against a 80% VPIP 30% PFR jackal?
Simple.. you beat the hell out of your premium hands. Raise a riduculous amount preflop with them. If they are raising 30% preflop, then LIMP with your AA, and reraise them all-in or enough to where more than half their stack is in the middle before the flop even comes. 4 out of 5 times you are winning.
Otherwise, play for sets, and crush them. You'll be doing a LOT of folding, but that's okay.. when you get a hand, they will pay you off anyways. Check-raise is your friend here. When you are at a table that is extremely insanely loose, you tighten up and crush them with your big hands. They won't even notice.
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#10
12-31-2004, 04:31 PM
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Re: Playing against a 80% VPIP 30% PFR jackal?
I think a common thing that kills good players when playing against terrible 80% guys like this is that they underestimate them. They say "this guy is terrible, I need to get my stack in against him". Basically the good player is tricked into playing poorly against a terrible player and ends up getting in way over his head with mediocre hands.
Just treat a bad player like everyone else. If you have a great hand and get reraised, by all means, go all in, but if you have a mediocre hand and get reraised, you have to let it go. Bad players catch good cards just as much as everyone else. Solid play vs. bad players will yield positive results over time, but you shouldn't expect to take their stack on every hand.
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