When is the point i can safely start counting outs

[Apocalypse]

nice comment, good insight thanx

[joker122]

With your read, I would just call the whole way, meaning I wouldn't raise the flop like you did.

If you consider his range of hands, a flop raise only results in less money for you: he'll either 3bet you with a better hand or correctly fold a hand with 2 outs.

[joker122]

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Since the pot is that big, you cant really fold anywhere, so the info you gain by raising the flop will help him alot more than you.

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Depending on how strong his read is, he can fold the turn unimproved if his flop raise gets 3bet by the BB. This way it will cost him less to just call all the way down and be shown AA, KK, or AK. But I've yet to find anyone at these tables who I'd have that strong of a read on. If I were playing against someone like you, for example, I would 3bet the flop.