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#1
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no reads
utg limps, sb limps, i check red 5s in bb flop is Ad4d2x, sb leads, i raise? |
#2
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I prefer calling here. If UTG calls, then it's pretty obvious that either
a) one of them has you beat and one of them has a draw, or b) both of them have you beat. It's very unlikely that both of them have nothing but a draw, but even if that's the case, they have oodles of outs since they have overcards to your pair in addition to their straight/flush draws. And the pot is very tiny. I don't like building a large pot with a dangerous hand. So, given no reads, I call the flop. If UTG calls and SB bets the turn, I raise the turn as a semibluff if I pick up a diamond on the turn. If not, I just call the turn and plan on calling the river. Oh, and if UTG folds to my turn raise and SB calls, I check behind on any river. |
#3
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I dont quite understand your argument. If we are often ahead on the flop, and both UTG and SB will have loads of outs, dont we want to protect our hand straight away?
I figure since the average SB ot UTG would have raised most hands with an ace PF, we are ahead on the flop most of the time, but very wounderable. Therefore I would generally raise the flop trying to make UTG fold. |
#4
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[ QUOTE ]
I dont quite understand your argument. If we are often ahead on the flop, and both UTG and SB will have loads of outs, dont we want to protect our hand straight away? I figure since the average SB ot UTG would have raised most hands with an ace PF, we are ahead on the flop most of the time, but very wounderable. Therefore I would generally raise the flop trying to make UTG fold. [/ QUOTE ] I don't think you're often way ahead on the flop. I think you're rarely way ahead on the flop (please see the two situations I presented in my first post). But you still have lots of ways of improving. So why not protect it? Because the pot is really small. You don't need to raise to protect your hand. A call is enough. UTG isn't going to call here unless he has a healthy draw or a made hand. If his hand is made, he won't fold to a raise.* If he's on a good draw (say...two overs and a flush draw), he's still correct to call getting 6:2. And you may get 3-bet. Now you've built a big pot, you're sandwiched, you have a hand that almost certainly needs to improve to win, and you have very few outs. It's true that a raise will force out an UTG who has two overs. But two overs are not nearly enough to call getting 5:1, and he's not likely to call with just overs since there's an ace on board. It's also true that a raise may buy you a free turn. But given the bad side of the raise (getting 3-bet, getting cold-called, or getting bet into again on the turn), I prefer calling. Yes, your hand is vulnerable. But w.r.t. protecting your hand, a raise won't do anything that a call wouldn't do. They both serve to protect your hand in this very small pot. I also disagree that most UTG players will preflop raise with any ace. Many of them will limp. *The only exception is that he'll likely fold an overpair to your fives, but there are very few overpairs with which a typical UTG will limp. Maybe 66 and 77. |
#5
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Raise the turn, check behind on the turn to any scare cards, call any river bet.
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#6
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Am i the only one that folds here? Against certain opponents i will raise or call, but against two unknowns (including a likely crappy UTG limper), i think i fold.
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#7
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FWIW, I also fold flop.
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#8
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[ QUOTE ]
Am i the only one that folds here? Against certain opponents i will raise or call, but against two unknowns (including a likely crappy UTG limper), i think i fold. [/ QUOTE ] nope, I fold as well. this pot is miniscule, all our outs are scare cards, opponents are unknown, we don't have position. |
#9
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Am i the only one that folds here? Against certain opponents i will raise or call, but against two unknowns (including a likely crappy UTG limper), i think i fold. [/ QUOTE ] nope, I fold as well. this pot is miniscule, all our outs are scare cards, opponents are unknown, we don't have position. [/ QUOTE ] How are our outs scare cards? Furthermore, UTG folds the vast majority of the time, so we do have position. |
#10
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[ QUOTE ]
Am i the only one that folds here? [/ QUOTE ] No. Homie don't play that game. I would continue after an SB bet only if I made a set or an OESD. If SB checked I would bet a rag flop. Otherwise I check and usually fold to an UTG bet. |
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