Aces up facing raise on river

pokernicus · #1 10-18-2005, 03:38 AM

My read is that villain is semi-loose. He tends to raise with a real hand, and just calls otherwise. What are the thoughts on how to play the river -- especially facing the raise. Do I three-bet, call, or fold?

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 3 folds, Hero calls, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button calls, 1 fold, BB checks.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button folds, BB folds, UTG folds.

Turn: (4.75 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, MP3 calls, CO calls.

River: (7.75 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, MP3 raises, CO folds, Hero??

Final Pot: 11.75 BB

milesdyson · #2 10-18-2005, 03:40 AM

3-bet and call a cap. he has K5 or K8 (K2 even?) a lot more often than A8/AK/AA/KK/55/22/88/34.

SlantNGo · #3 10-18-2005, 03:20 PM

[ QUOTE ]
3-bet and call a cap. he has K5 or K8 (K2 even?) a lot more often than A8/AK/AA/KK/55/22/88/34.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, I just call this... maybe me 1.9 river agg. over 10k hands is actually telling me something useful. I guess I have to push more edges on the river.

milesdyson · #4 10-18-2005, 04:07 PM

unless the guy slowplayed AK/A8 or a set the whole way, we have the best hand.

the slowplay usually lasts until the turn. don't get me wrong, some players LOVE to string it out until the end, but most don't. so when you get raised on the river, it's mostly because the river card improved their hand. and in this hand, the only hands that the K improved to beat ours are KK/AK, both of which get raised preflop by almost every player.

3-betting this shouldn't be hard, and while i wouldn't say it's a 0.9 BB mistake (as shill said earlier), it's up there.

SlantNGo · #5 10-18-2005, 04:12 PM

What if the river card was a 9? Would you still 3-bet with the straight possibility?

What about if the river was a total brick? i.e. AJ5 flop, turn 2, river 8. Should I still 3-bet despite the set possibility?

milesdyson · #6 10-18-2005, 04:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What if the river card was a 9? Would you still 3-bet with the straight possibility?

[/ QUOTE ]
no, and not only because a new set of 16 hands now beats us (76), but because he could logically play A9 like this as well.

[ QUOTE ]
What about if the river was a total brick? i.e. AJ5 flop, turn 2, river 8. Should I still 3-bet despite the set possibility?

[/ QUOTE ]
now there are less likely limping hands to be improved by the card. J8/A8 is all really, and A8 now beats us. not many players limp 85. i would not raise here, either.

you could count the hands and come to an estimated guess based on those numbers - i'm just trying to show the thought process one would go through during the hand.

#7 10-18-2005, 04:10 AM

What are you afraid of here? He would have raised KK preflop, and given you a lot more action on earlier streets too, so KK is not a likely hand. Same goes for AK.

He probably spiked a lower two pair than yours.
I'd re-raise that river I think, or atleast call it.

I guess he could have slowplayed 88 too but that would be stupid play.

#8 10-18-2005, 05:17 AM

Grunching...

My instinct says 3-bet. if he caps call. I estimating him at KK or a lower two pair. If he has AK oh well - but I think he would have reraised with that on the flop.

Shillx · #9 10-18-2005, 05:27 AM

Well it is too bad that you just called here. You lost .9 BB or whatever by not reraising.

Brad

TomBrooks · #10 10-18-2005, 02:55 PM

Three bet is good unless MP is one of those guys that slowplays sets or TPTK and limps AK.

Since you feel he raises with a real hand, three bet.