$55: HU Hand

#1 10-10-2005, 09:11 PM

I realize that HU is more of an art, but this hand was very interesting.

I've been playing fairly aggressive throughout the tournament, raising and pushing a lot. I was outplaying everyone in this particular tournament and everyone gave a lot of respect for my raises.

This did not stop HU either, as I was raising and pushing a lot against this guy when he had a large chip lead. I took 1200 chips from him without a showdown. So this guy's agitated, I'm sure. But that's about the only read I have, since any read I had for almost any person goes right down the tube when it becomes HU.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (2 handed) converter

Button (t8095)
Hero (t5405)

Preflop: Hero is BB with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Button calls t100, Hero checks.

Flop: (t400) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets t400, Hero calls t400.

Turn: (t1200) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets t800, Hero calls t800.

River: (t2800) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets t6695 (All-In), Hero calls t4005 (All-In).

Final Pot: t13500

Any thoughts on how you would play it differently and the logic behind it would be nice.

the shadow · #2 10-10-2005, 11:08 PM

Thanks for not posting the results.

Maybe you made a great read and at showdown the villian flashed a busted diamond flush draw or AQ, but this hand doesn't strike me as too interesting. You flop 2d pair and call it down all the way until you're all-in at the river.

By just calling, you never offered villian an opportunity to fold.

Ask yourself -- what hand does villian have? It could be almost anything, with Kx the most likely. Your line never forced villian to define his hand.

These are just my thoughts, but here're a few suggestions:

1. With 2d pair, think about betting the flop with the intention of folding to a raise and check-folding the turn.

2. Fold the turn.

3. Fold the river.

4. If you want to be aggressive, reraise the flop or lead out the turn, rather than just calling.

The Shadow

#3 10-10-2005, 11:32 PM

I didn't post the result because I don't want results fogging the thought processes of others.

My line did force him to define his hand. I was trying to show that from what went on throughout the tournament, but now that you replied I can describe it better.

I'm showing nothing about my hand by just calling. The fact is that I've been betting and raising a whole lot throughout the tournament because there was just a ton of steal opportunities that came to me and I never had to show my hand down unless it was the winning one.

Basically, the key point is that a bet by me in this hand means nothing to him. This means that he could reraise with garbage, and when I just call the reraise I am now defining my own hand without any information on what he has. At that point he can shove it all-in with nothing on the turn too, and the only way to avoid that is by reraising all-in on the flop and I certainly don't want to do that with medium pair.

So for the flop, I didn't bet with 2nd pair because there was a really high chance of getting reraised by him with anything, and I had a decent holding for HU.

Edit: I would like you to explain to me how his most likely holding is Kx, given this new information.

#4 10-10-2005, 11:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]

So for the flop, I didn't bet with 2nd pair because there was a really high chance of getting reraised by him with anything, and I had a decent holding for HU.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wouldn't getting reraised by anything be an exceedingly good thing? I can see the line you took being better only if you know he's going to keep betting at you with less than second pair.

#5 10-10-2005, 11:41 PM

It's not good to be reraised with anything because most people does not have a higher percentage of reraising with garbage than with legitimate hands. I'm forced to make a guessing game, and risk half/all of my stack by doing so when I have a legitimate hand myself for HU.

#6 10-11-2005, 12:29 AM

[ QUOTE ]

So for the flop, I didn't bet with 2nd pair because there was a really high chance of getting reraised by him with anything, and I had a decent holding for HU.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
It's not good to be reraised with anything because most people do not have a higher percentage of reraising with garbage than with legitimate hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

What does "anything" mean? The first suggests bad hands, the second suggests legitimate.

Isn't this where loose-agressive play pays off? You drive your opponent to disbelief that you have anything good and they go over the top of you with a marginal holding. If he had a great hand, I think he flat calls a flop bet.

I think just calling helps your opponent draw out on your middle pair on the turn and river more often than it helps you win more chips.

Your overly agressive play HU will have more of an effect on your table image than the good hands you've had to show down previously.

I bet the flop here.

adanthar · #7 10-10-2005, 11:50 PM

Against a super aggro player, I would often play it like this the whole way and expect to have the best hand at showdown. Once in a while, I'd CR the turn.

If you lost this - which is unlikely - it's most often to 87 or to a better 9.

#8 10-11-2005, 12:08 AM

I'm the super aggro player. He's not that aggressive, as I have described that I robbed him of quite a few chips.

Skip Brutale · #9 10-11-2005, 01:22 AM

I might consider just pushing all-in preflop in order to keep intimidating him and letting him know he cant call your blind. The rest of the hand I would deffinately just call all the way.

#10 10-11-2005, 02:35 PM

I guess it is hard to find this as interesting now that I look at it from a third-person perspective. It's just the type of read and play throughout the hand in which I feel that I played perfectly.

Preflop: I flat call with 10-9o. It's a decent hand for HU, and a raise would only make the pot bigger since he will call with anything.

Flop: I check, sensing that if I bet there's a very high chance of him raising with anything (which means garbage or legitimate), and if I just call that raise then I'm giving away the strength of my own hand without getting any information about him. At that point he can go all-in on the turn too, so now I have to guess if I'm beating him with 2nd pair. Not a situation I want to be in. I will call a bet on the flop, but I'm not going to let him bet me out of the pot unless he really has something.

Turn: I check again for nearly the same reason, except now it's more about pot size control. If he doesn't have anything, he has to risk a large portion of his stack to win so little. He bets the turn, and I call. He may have something, he may not. But I have to pay him off at least this much with 2nd pair HU.

River: At this point, I can get a lot of information on what he has from what he does here. Looking back at the hand, I never bet and I never raised. He had to be afraid of me not betting since I am superaggressive, but that all changed when I checked the river. I'm looking very weak right now, just calling as if to say "I want to check this through". On the other hand, I may also just be calling because I have a king and a weak kicker, or that I have a fairly weak hand and just calling, hoping to check it down.

So why in the world would anyone shove it all-in here with a legitimate hand? My most likely holding is a fairly weak hand, followed by a king with a weak kicker. I've been sending the message clear as day, "I want to check it down". If he didn't have a king, he'd have to be pretty afraid of me wanting to check/call down a king with weak kicker. If he did have a strong king, he would want to maximize my chances of calling by betting a reasonable amount because my most likely holding is not a king. There was also an off-chance that I was trying to be really tricky here with a monster, and if he's the type of player that's afraid of that then he'd just bet a modest amount and call an all-in from me. Now I had to call, there was absolutely no way I could be beat here.

Results: He shows J5o. I win the pot.

This hand is interesting to me because I don't get to play superaggressive very often (usually controlled aggression, not maniac like this game). It showed that when nobody respects your bets, then checking or calling gives much more information than betting ever will.