Winning the minimum with AA

aflaba · #1 08-23-2005, 01:30 PM

I just don't know. I've been playing poker for 15 months now. I've read close to 20 books. I have almost a total of 1000 posts on this forum. I've played 150,000 hands...

and this is the result. I don't like beating myself up, but sometimes it's hard not to. I make mistakes all the time. Both because of lack of strategic knowledge and because of something else... that I don't know what it is.

Villain is weak passive.

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
3 folds, Hero raises, BB calls.

Flop: (4 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, BB calls.

Turn: (3 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, BB bets, Hero calls.

River: (5 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks.

Final Pot: 5 BB

jba · #2 08-23-2005, 01:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Hero is weak passive.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP

Danenania · #3 08-23-2005, 01:46 PM

Bet turn
Fold to raise
Bet river
Fold to raise

wackjob · #4 08-23-2005, 01:57 PM

Should have bet the entire hand. Folding sucks too.

Danenania · #5 08-23-2005, 01:58 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Folding sucks too.

[/ QUOTE ]

W
H
Y
?

Mig · #6 08-23-2005, 02:03 PM

You fold a lot of AA headsup in 10/20 ?

baronzeus · #7 08-23-2005, 02:04 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You fold a lot of AA headsup in 10/20 ?

[/ QUOTE ]

When a weak passive player fights back, I do.

Danenania · #8 08-23-2005, 02:10 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You fold a lot of AA headsup in 10/20 ?

[/ QUOTE ]

If it's warranted. Bad call downs with AA heads up are still bad call downs.

Note that weak passive players don't bluff raise and don't raise 4 straight turns for free showdowns with single pairs. And even if he will do one of these things once in a blue moon, the pot still isn't big enough to call down.

augie00 · #9 08-23-2005, 02:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Folding sucks too.

[/ QUOTE ]

W
H
Y
?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because nobody ever makes reads and they simply assume that all turn raises are bluffs. Although if you muck every time you're raised on the turn you'll get run over, if you have a good read on someone and you're confident, muck away.

StellarWind · #10 08-23-2005, 03:22 PM

Folding sucks.

Folding AA in this situation is an extreme position and requires very strong evidence. A generalization that Villain is weak and passive is completely inadequate justification.

Many tight/passive players have brains and definite ideas about different situations that arise during the game. His feelings about this type of four-straight board are unique to him and don't necessarily have anything to do with (e.g.) his PFR of 7% or his penchant for making weak folds with unimproved overcards. Unless you have seen him handle situations very similar to this you cannot predict how he is going to react.

If you want a concrete reason, the free showdown play is a weak-tight favorite. There actually is a fair case for calling a turn raise but folding the river if you fail to improve. You get your outs and quite possibly you get a free showdown when you are best. But normally I would call a raise down.

Interesting though it may be however, the fold to a raise question is a red herring. There is no doubt that Hero must bet this turn. You cannot give a free card with an overpair because you are ahead of so many hands compared to the number you are behind. You will not be raised that often. As a multitabling online player with other demands on your attention, the only correct course of action is to make the obvious bet and think about the raise if it happens. There is no reason to be sweating a problem that does not affect your current play.