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#1
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On the 3-bet flop that I was behind? Or did I have good reason to call this one down? I think he checked the river fearing a made flush.
*edit* no read on the table , this was one of my first hands at the table Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) converter Preflop: Hero is CO with T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls. Flop: (10 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, MP1 folds, Hero calls. Turn: (8.50 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls. River: (10.50 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> SB checks, Hero checks. Final Pot: 10.50 BB |
#2
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I'm fairly sure you are behind, unless you know he will bet that 5 or 3 and be aggressive as he will to bet the J. I think laying it down to the 3-bet is ok, or you could have use WA/WB.
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#3
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I don't like laying it down to the three-bet. You'll be getting like 15-1 on a call, and you can probably make up the difference (about 4 BB) necessary to call purely for set value. The real reason not to fold, though, is that it's the same thing as putting a big old bulls-eye on your head. Force your opponents to raise the turn to get you to go away. This is like the one metagame lesson Ed mentions really stresses in SSH.
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#4
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definitely WA/WB situation. anyone like a flop cap and fold to a turn lead?
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#5
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[ QUOTE ]
definitely WA/WB situation. anyone like a flop cap and fold to a turn lead? [/ QUOTE ] WA/WB should be reserved for hands that are less vulnerable to draws. |
#6
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] definitely WA/WB situation. anyone like a flop cap and fold to a turn lead? [/ QUOTE ] WA/WB should be reserved for hands that are less vulnerable to draws. [/ QUOTE ] point taken, but what about the line? it looks to me that the villain bet into the draw and checked when the third club hit. now imagine we are on the flop again. if he is chasing the flush, how could he call the cap and lead the turn? but if he is on AA-JJ or AJ, how could he not lead the turn? doesn't that tell us everything we need to know? |
#7
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] definitely WA/WB situation. anyone like a flop cap and fold to a turn lead? [/ QUOTE ] WA/WB should be reserved for hands that are less vulnerable to draws. [/ QUOTE ] point taken, but what about the line? it looks to me that the villain bet into the draw and checked when the third club hit. now imagine we are on the flop again. if he is chasing the flush, how could he call the cap and lead the turn? but if he is on AA-QQ or AJ, how could he not lead the turn? doesn't that tell us everything we need to know? [/ QUOTE ] I think you're misapplying the WA/WB idea. In fact, this is very much different from that because there is the potential that we are up against draws. For WA/WB to apply, we really need to know that both us and villain are unlikely to improve our hands. So, WA/WB usually refers to lines of play that involve playing fairly passively in situations where the overall situation is unlikely to change. Here, a lot can change. As for your line, think about how often villain is playing a worse hand. What hands, other than flush draws, does villain play like this that we're beating? This hand is similar to BigEndian's TT hand, in some ways. There, we concurred that it's probably pretty easy to fold the turn once villain has shown aggression beyond our flop raise. There are some important differences but I wonder if similar concepts apply. |
#8
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Any reads on sb? Hard to comment on this hand without a read. If he's an unknown I'd probably fold to the 3-bet.
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#9
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yeah, i am gonna edit the first post, this was one of my first couple hands. no read
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#10
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As you played it it's a tough one. Folding the turn is probably best.
I think I would call the flop in this hand and raise any non-club, non-Ace turn. I might get a little confused if an offsuit Q or K comes too, but I may very well still raise it. Also, we get to watch more action on the turn. If it goes bet, raise we can get away cheap although that seems unlikely to happen without a K,Q or A dropping. As it is, if SB has a baby flush draw or even worse, a flush draw with an overcard and MP has two overs we're not gaining much at all by raising the flop. Basically you and the SB are each making about 40% of MP's call (this is assuming SB and MP just call your flop raise) If you raise the turn on a safe card SB is going to have a really hard time 3 betting you without a monster so you can fold to a 3 bet and take your free showdown as I want to get to showdown with my tens on this board with that draw there. I'm not writing very clearly at the moment but I think it may be better to wait and raise a safe turn here. -WT |
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