When the heck did I get to be WEAK-TIGHT?!?!?

[PocketJokers72]

B&M 2/5NL ($200 max) table.
Potawatomi Casino

Main Table.

Relevant Stacks:

EP Tricky Uber-LAG Asian Perma-raiser: $5000+
MP New Guy (4 hands, no-see-um) $600+
LP TP/Rockish $500+
Button HERO TAG/LAG Gear Switching Donk: $1650+

Perma-raising Uber-LAG asian makes it $20 to go in EP

New Guy who had just been moved here 4 hands or so ago calls

LP Rock call

I find 4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] on the button, and I call

Blinds fold.

Pot: $80+

Flop: Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

LAG amazingly checks.
New Guy bets $35
LP calls
HERO raises, making it $135 to go.

LAG amazingly folds.

New guy insta-pushes , making it about $425 for HERO to call

LP Folds

HERO goes in the tank, thinks about, probably way too long, and talked myself out of calling. I fold and new guy does not show.

Logic running through my melon:
I was 95% sure he had a set of 7s.
He did not re-raise, hence he did not have QQ.
He probably puts me on TPTK, and has that beat.

Alternately, he has 2 pr (Q7/Q4/74).

I had a nice run that night, why should I take a third off my stack now when I have already convinced myself that I drawing dead to quads?

After seeing some the this guy's moves and showdowns, there is NO WAY he had a set of 7s. I think I am a moron after the fact. I was probably waaaay ahead of his Q7o.

[theben]

i'd have been a bit confused but would have called

[PocketJokers72]

I was very confused...which I think lead to me laying it down. I was on the tail end of a long session, and had not been forced to make a stong laydown at all that night. I do try to keep my eye out for times when I should just run away like a scared little girl. I'm pretty sure that I manufactured this in my own head and saw monsters under the bed when they were only dust-bunnies.

I think strong-is-weak should have been my read and I should have (correctly?) put him on Top 2 pair, CALLED, and let him try to hit his 4 outs to beat me.

[BigF]

I would call his push because he bet out on a board of Q74 rainbow with two people behind him. Therefore it's not very likely he had a set of 7's.

Most likely he had AA/KK and tried to "trap" you guys. He could also have had two pair if he's a donk.

[theben]

id be concerned with a set of 7's. other than that, not too much else that you gotta worry about. odd thing is, aside from a set of 7's, theres no other hand that he has that he wasn't "donking" with at some point in the hand

id call because its not too much money, theres certainly enough of a chance hes donking, and also because you have a very strong hand and very strong hands are hard to beat. (very limited combinations of hands- only 6- that you lose to

[Indiana]

This is actually very tough. I began writing that laying down set over set is insane, but this is a cash game and what did he call with pre-flop?? I put him on AQ, 77, or QQ. I can see folding here, this is a very tough situation that doesn't come up a lot. Set over set is a long shot, but you have to go with your reads....I cannot say that you did the wrong thing.

Indy

[poboy]

What you began to write would have been absolutely correct. It is insane to worry about set over set, and we're not even talking about deep stacks either. This is a very easy call. JMO

[Indiana]

In most cases worrying about set over set is bad. But what do you put him on in this case??

Indy

[poboy]

With the stack sizes in question I really wouldn't worry about putting him on a hand but I think AK,KQ,mid-small pp, and all sorts of wierd 2 pr combinations are all possibilities. If stacks were deeper I might be a little more hesitant but even then barring a great read I probably call, why would someone play a set that fast on such a nice flop. Just try to keep in mind a set is rare, when you do actually flop one you need to be prepared to go to the felt with it almost always(and you will rarely be wrong in doing so). JMO

[xorbie]

Jesus if you are going to fold to a push why bother raising?