1/2 NL Live, AA Laydown?

[boxedIn]

Playing 1/2 NL in AC. I've been playing for a while and have a stack of $500. Villian in this hand just sat down approximately 6 hands ago. He's seen most flops so far (hasn't played post-flop except once when he showed down trips with JQ on a JJx board) and has a stack of approximately $300. (This happend a little bit ago, so the stack sizes and bets might be a little bit off, but don't get on my case about those discrepancies. It's should still be a fairly accurate portrayl.)

I have no real read on villian in this hand, and I suspect he has no real read of me.

Dealt A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] in the SB. 4 limps, including villian who is on the button (this is normal). I raise to $15. Loosish guy in MP calls, as does button.

Flop is K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (Pot: $50)

I lead out for $40. MP drops. Button raises to $90. I call.

Turn is a 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] putting flush on the board. (Pot: $230)

I check. Button bets $90. I call.

River is a 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] putting 4 diamonds on the board. (Pot: $410)

I check. Button goes allin, approximately $100 or so. I call.

Final Pot Size: $610

Comments on all streets appreciated.

[amoeba]

I lay it down on the turn.

[AthenianStranger]

[ QUOTE ]

I lay it down on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Failing that, the river. Unless you could see that the fourth diamond made him nervous. He goes all-in with four diamonds on the board and you don't have one? I fold.

[A-Baum]

I would be tempted to come back over the top of him on that flop to the tune of about $175 at least. If he has a set on the flop you're in trouble, but if he's drawing you better make him think twice about chasing. You KNOW you have the best hand on the flop, jam the pot.

I'm insta-folding that turn.

Couldn't you even fathom that you're beat on the turn, let alone the river? Tunnel vision man...AA can be cracked, believe it or not.

[boxedIn]

Is there any justification for calling on the river (ignoring folding on the other streets, that is) simply due to the large pot ($500) and the relatively small bet ($100) that you have to call? If that bet was reduced to say ($80), since I'm not precisely sure of the bet amounts, does that change the river call (from 5:1 to 6.25:1)?

From what I can remember about the player, he was a younger looking guy (probably right around 21) who was pretty quiet and had ordered a few drinks (but didn't appear drunk). He didn't do anything really overtly tell-like during the hand, as far as I can remember ... his river push, when checked to, was relatively quick.

I guess what I'm asking here is, on the river, what percentage chance do you think a guy like I've described and the way the hand played out is bluffing? How low does the river bet have to be before you're making that "I'm almost positive you have me, but goddammit it's just too small" call?

[empty]

[ QUOTE ]
Is there any justification for calling on the river

[/ QUOTE ]

I NEVER call this river. You don't have a [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. IMO this is an instant laydown.

[iceman5]

There are a couple lessons here.
1) Dont call a $15 raise with KJ
2) Dont try to bluff at this level. People wont fold AA.
3) Dont try to bluff at this level. People wont fold AA.

The play will work on good players. This is obvious because most 2+2 ers wouldve folded. But youre not playing 2+2ers in these low stakes live games.

Did I mention that people wont fold AA?

[boxedIn]

[ QUOTE ]
There are a couple lessons here.
1) Dont call a $15 raise with KJ
2) Dont try to bluff at this level. People wont fold AA.
3) Dont try to bluff at this level. People wont fold AA.

The play will work on good players. This is obvious because most 2+2 ers wouldve folded. But youre not playing 2+2ers in these low stakes live games.

Did I mention that people wont fold AA?

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Not to be annoying, but I'd prefer no more responses like this. I do know what I'm doing, to a fairly good degree, and I know people don't normally fold AA. However I put him more on AK than AA (or KQ or QQ, QQ with the Q of [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] was my main concern) and I'm not really defending my move with KJ. I really am not. I was decently drunk at the time, and to be honest my read on the SB wasn't very good -- in fact, it was probably just a thought in my head that I decided was fact.

I know that bluffing with KJ isn't optimal in this spot, just as I know that calling with AA isn't optimal in this spot. Perhaps an interesting question for people in general is ... which is the worst play -- KJ or AA? I'm willing to bet people vote for AA as the worst, but that's just cause I think I know the thought pattern of 2+2ers.

Anyway, I should stop responding to posts so quickly just cause I'm bored. Later.