Consecutive All-In situations. need critique please.

cs3 · #1 06-29-2005, 05:17 AM

These were 2 consecutive hands at Party NL 25 6max

First hand looks like the villian was a complete idiot. Regardless, is the standard way to play a set?

#Game No : 2280934545
***** Hand History for Game 2280934545 *****
$25 NL Hold'em - Wednesday, June 29, 03:06:15 EDT 2005
Table Table 36674 (6 max) (Real Money)
Seat 1 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 4: jammasterj3 ( $34.42 )
Seat 6: kmclutch ( $39.45 )
Seat 3: f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] ( $16.6 )
Seat 1: Titans506 ( $13.13 )
Seat 5: Surfmerrick ( $29.45 )
Seat 2: snwslider ( $22.5 )
snwslider posts small blind [$0.1].
f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] [color:blue] hero [/color] posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to f_lock [ 5c 5d ]
jammasterj3 folds.
Surfmerrick raises [$0.5].
kmclutch folds.
Titans506 folds.
snwslider calls [$0.4].
f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] calls [$0.25].
** Dealing Flop ** [ 7c, 4d, 5s ]
snwslider checks.
>You have options at Table 36789 (6 max) Table!.
f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] bets [$1.5].
Surfmerrick raises [$3].
snwslider folds.
f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] raises [$8.5].
Surfmerrick calls [$7].
** Dealing Turn ** [ 9h ]
f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] is all-In [$6.1]
>You have options at Table 36789 (6 max) Table!.
Surfmerrick calls [$6.1].
** Dealing River ** [ 2d ]
f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] shows [ 5c, 5d ] three of a kind, fives.
Surfmerrick shows [ Ad, 4s ] a pair of fours. [color:blue] are you serious!?!? [/color]
f_lock wins $32.05 from the main pot with three of a kind, fives.
Game #2280939497 starts.

[color:blue] Do you play this any diffferently? does yourstack size affect how you would have played this hand?[/color]

[color:blue] Now the next hand is the one i'm more interested in discussing. have played a couple hundred hands the last two days with villian, and notes say he is "fairly tight, not very aggresssive post flop. raises any pair preflop and reraises any raise to $15 with JJ-AA". [/color]

#Game No : 2280939497
***** Hand History for Game 2280939497 *****
$25 NL Hold'em - Wednesday, June 29, 03:07:46 EDT 2005
Table Table 36674 (6 max) (Real Money)
Seat 2 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 4: jammasterj3 ( $34.42 )
Seat 6: kmclutch ( $39.45 )
Seat 3: f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] ( $32.05 )
Seat 1: Titans506 ( $13.13 )
Seat 5: Surfmerrick ( $12.85 )
Seat 2: snwslider ( $22 )
f_lock posts small blind [$0.1].
jammasterj3 posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to f_lock [ Js Ac ]

Surfmerrick raises [$0.5].
kmclutch raises [$0.75].
Titans506 folds.
snwslider folds.
f_lock calls [$0.65].
jammasterj3 calls [$0.5].
Surfmerrick calls [$0.25].
** Dealing Flop ** [ 5c, 9c, Jh ]
>You have options at Table 36789 (6 max) Table!.
f_lock [color:blue] hero [/color] bets [$3].
jammasterj3 folds.
Surfmerrick folds.
kmclutch calls [$3]. [color:blue] what do you put him on here?[/color]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Kc ]
f_lock bets [$10].
kmclutch calls [$10].
** Dealing River ** [ Th ]
[color:blue] now i am fairly sure i am behind to either 2 pair or set. flush not likely as the only hands I think he raises with pre-flop that make flush are club suited AK/AQ/AJ/KQ, none of which he can have given the board and my own hand.
Now what do you do? I will post what i did (and my reasoning) and the results of this hand after I hear some of your ideas. [/color]

also how do i convert the hand history to make it easy to read here on the forum (and so the player names kept confidential?)

ticks · #2 06-29-2005, 08:07 AM

Converter:
http://www.selachian.com/tools/bison...hconverter.cgi

cs3 · #3 06-29-2005, 03:20 PM

thanks! hands now converted:

2 consecutive hands from Party 25 NL 6 max

Hand 1
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ Hero (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Button ($13.13)
SB ($22.5)
Hero ($16.6)
UTG ($34.42)
MP ($29.45)
CO ($39.45)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.1.
1 fold, MP raises to $0.5, 2 folds, SB (poster) calls $0.40, Hero calls $0.25.

Flop: ($1.50) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $1.5, MP raises to $3, SB folds, Hero raises to $10, MP calls $7.

Turn: ($21.50) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP calls $6.10.

River: ($27.60) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)

Final Pot: $27.60
He showed a pair of 4's with ace kicker...
Was this play standard (asided from fact that villian was complete idiot)? Do you play any streeets differently? I think that hand may have infleuneced the play in the very next one...

Hand 2

This is the more interesting hand and the one I am most looking forward to feedback on.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 6 handed) converter

CO ($13.13)
Button ($22)
Hero ($32.05)
BB ($34.42)
UTG ($12.85)
MP ($39.45)

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Hero posts a blind of $0.1.
UTG raises to $0.5, MP raises to $0.75, 2 folds, Hero (poster) calls $0.65, BB calls $0.50, UTG calls $0.25.

Flop: ($3) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero bets $3, BB folds, UTG folds, MP calls $3.

Turn: ($9) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $10, MP calls $10.

River: ($29) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)

Now what do you do?
What hand do you put him on for each street?
With the turn call I am am fairly sure i am behind to either 2 pair or set. flush not likely as the only hands I think he raises with pre-flop that make flush are club suited AK/AQ/AJ/KQ, none of which he can have given the board and my own hand.
I will post what i did (and my reasoning) and the results of this hand after I hear some of your ideas. Thanks.

TheWorstPlayer · #4 06-29-2005, 03:24 PM

Fold preflop. Looks like he has a big pair. First hand is good.

cs3 · #5 06-29-2005, 03:50 PM

Forgto mention that I had played a couple hundred hands with villian in the previous 2 days. Notes said he was fairly tight, not very aggresssive post flop. raised any pair or big non-pair preflop and reraises any raise to $15 with JJ-AA

the .75 raise was his standard. I had seen him raise to $3 once when he showed down AA and another time when i didnt see his cards

Laomedon · #6 06-29-2005, 04:21 PM

In hand two, why not go for a checkraise on that flop to see where you're at? Obviously you would feel better about it if the flop was rainbow, but still, there is a high probability that the original raiser will bet that flop. If you checkraise and then get reraised you can get away from it right there. Given your line, once your flop bet gets called you need to slow down, it seems pretty clear by his turn call that you're behind so I would proceed with caution on the river unless this guy is a complete maniac.

cs3 · #7 06-29-2005, 04:36 PM

Hmm, i didnt even think about a check raise on the flop. Thats not a play i normally make with TPTK but maybe i should start trying it?

Since he just called my flop bet though I felt i had to raise potsized on the turnto seee where i now stood.

If he had a set i had 11 outs (J's and clubs, if he had 2 pair I had 13 outs (J's A's and clubs). If he had had the flushwhich i thought very unlikely as stated above, I had 7 outs to the nut flush.
I expected a raise/allin if he was ahead. He just called so I still didnt get quite the info i wanted, but was pretty sure i was behind, and that he had no idea what I was holding.

So what do you do with that river card?

centja1 · #8 06-29-2005, 05:10 PM

I can't think of any hand with which he would call with that board on the turn that couldn't beat a pair of jacks. He may have feared the flush somewhat, but his call has to indicate that he could make a hand to beat a flush on the river.

If I had to guess, he has either a set of Kings or pocket queens including the Queen of clubs. In either case, you were beaten the entire time.

However, i think there is a decent chance that a bet will win the pot for you in this example. With your willingness to make a pot sized bet when the flush card came out, he may have given you credit for flush.

Of course, you seem to have a decent amount of playing time with your opponent to make a judgment about whether he will make a call on the end with Queens. The call with Kings is still difficult, but not nearly as dauting as it would be with queens.

The real question about whether to bet or not boils down to whether or not he will think you were semibluffing on the flop or betting with jacks.

It's an interesting hand, though.

cs3 · #9 06-29-2005, 05:13 PM

I realize that i greatly overplayed TPTK, but given that I am here at the river what do you think he puts me on?

Is this an easy check/fold? Push? Something esle I'm not seeing?

More insight appreciated.

Results tonight after work...