Help discounting outs

[og5]

I think I’m giving myself too many outs so I thought I’d post some situations to see how many outs you guys would apply. If there are any other variables you might consider (like your opponent, # of opponents or position) please let me know.

All suited hands are spades

1.JTs

Board:6h7sQs

2.35s

Board:6h7sQs

3.5h5s

Board:6c7h8d

4.9h9s

Board:TsJsQh

5.JhJs

Board:9dTdQd

6.98s

Board:7s6s7cTc

7.KsQh

Board:JcTc9sQc

8.98s

Board:QcJd6d5d

Thanks

[no1super2001]

This is a good exercise. I am counting all outs to improve. I am in no way in a position to add the positional handicap. Being a newbie, I will leave that to the pooh-bahs.

1.JTs

Board:6h7sQs => 10.5

2.35s

Board:6h7sQs => 3


3.5h5s

Board:6c7h8d => 8

4.9h9s

Board:TsJsQh => 9.5

5.JhJs

Board:9dTdQd => 7, figuring I am beaten if another D falls

6.98s

Board:7s8s7cTc => ? How many 8 of spades in this deck?

7.KsQh

Board:JcTc9sQc => 7

8.98s

Board:QcJd6d5d => 6

[Shillx]

1. At the very least, you have about 8 outs with this hand (about 31% equity against a big field). In a HU situation, your hand might be worth as many as 17 outs (about 60% equity). At the very least, you will have 10 outs playing HU (39% equity).

2. HU this hand is worth about 13-14 outs (about 50% equity). Against a big field it is good for at least 7-8 outs. JTs is a stronger hand then 53s in this spot though.

3. Your hand is worth about 3-4 outs against a field.

4. 4-5 outs multiway.

5. 5 outs.

6. Your hand is worth close to 30 outs. HU you have almost all the equity.

7. This is a strong hand. It is worth about 15-20 outs.

8. Not so good, maybe 4-5 outs.

Brad

[og5]

Sorry changed it to 6s

[cmwck]

[ QUOTE ]


6. Your hand is worth close to 30 outs. HU you have almost all the equity.


[/ QUOTE ]

30 outs??? I only see 9 cards (the 9 remaining spades) that will give hero a better hand.

[Shillx]

We have a straight and a flush draw. We have tons of equity here.

[cmwck]

[ QUOTE ]
We have a straight and a flush draw. We have tons of equity here.

[/ QUOTE ]
Wait, are we counting equity or outs in this exercise? Or are you figuring the equity and then converting that to outs?

[AlmightyJay]

[ QUOTE ]
6. Your hand is worth close to 30 outs. HU you have almost all the equity.

[/ QUOTE ]

30 outs? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] How do you even get that many outs? You already have a straight, the only way to improve is by hitting a flush (or a straight flush, but that's counted in the flush outs). The flush is 9 outs. Where did the other 21 come from?

[ QUOTE ]
7. This is a strong hand. It is worth about 15-20 outs.

[/ QUOTE ]

Are we reading the same post? Hero has the top end of a one-card straight, and no draw whatsoever (unless you count the A's). Where are you getting these outs?

[Shillx]

When you do weighted equity calculations, you have to consider outs from every angle. One guy once told me that if you flop a straight, you are still "drawing". You are "drawing for blanks". So if someone has a flush draw against you on 4th street, you have 35 outs. You have to consider these when you look at inflection points of a peticular hand (that is, if you should call down or fold against what is assumed to be a stronger hand).

Brad

[bottomset]

[ QUOTE ]
When you do weighted equity calculations, you have to consider outs from every angle. One guy once told me that if you flop a straight, you are still "drawing". You are "drawing for blanks". So if someone has a flush draw against you on 4th street, you have 35 outs. You have to consider these when you look at inflection points of a peticular hand (that is, if you should call down or fold against what is assumed to be a stronger hand).

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah I was confused at first to your post, but it made a lot of sense once I looked closer