you can never be too careful

[Tommy Angelo]

Full $20-40 at FW. Two players limped and I raised from the hijack seat with KQ. The cutoff called, the button called, both blinds folded, and the limpers called. Fiveway pot with me third.

The flop was K-6-6 rainbow. The limpers checked, I checked, the cutoff checked, the button bet, both limpers folded, I called, and the cutoff called. Three players now with me first.

The turn was a king. I checked, the cutoff checked, the button bet, I called, and the cutoff folded. Headsup now. I planned to bet the river unless a six came.

The river was a six. Final board: K-6-6,K,6. I checked, the button bet, and I called. He rolled 7-7.

[partygirluk]

I like it.

[bicyclekick]

You left the moaning and groaning after you tabled KQ. Don't leave out very important parts like that. :P

[mike l.]

"I planned to bet the river unless a six came.'

why? i think youll make more by checkraising the river.

[SoBeDude]

How is this anything close to an appropriate line?

[bigfishead]

[ QUOTE ]
How is this anything close to an appropriate line?

[/ QUOTE ]

It appropriately adds a little "huh?" to the other players game when playing Tommy in future hands. Just for that occasional confusion.

[Doubling12]

He's either way ahead or way behind, couldn't possibly get a better hand to fold, and there are no draws on the board. And he gets to smooth roll the "monster", which really isn't a monster if you think about it, but the opponents probably don't. Nothing wrong with kicking the button in the groin early in the session.

[roy_miami]

[ QUOTE ]
He's either way ahead or way behind

[/ QUOTE ]

He's either tied or way ahead. If you can put the button on 6x here, you are seeing way too many big ugly monsters under the bed. I'm not sure which is better between betting out or going for a check-raise on the river, but check-call is the second best option just slightly above check fold.

[nolanfan34]

[ QUOTE ]
How is this anything close to an appropriate line?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a high limit guy, but I read posts in this part of the forum often, especially Tommy's posts. This Tommy post is just another in a long line where I'm starting to notice some trends:

- I read the post and immediately think about how poor/strange the line looks.
- Yet when I think about what my line would be, or my response, if I was to reply, I always have a hard time coming up with something that would make more money against a semi-thinking opponent.
- He doesn't always include reads, but you know he has them, and is leaving them out for a reason. In this case, if his read is that the button will fold to a turn check-raise, then his line was optimal, right? These hands aren't the same as if it was against Party 15/30 players from what I gather.
- He buys a boatload of free showdowns.
- Players have to be worried when he check/calls uncoordinated boards. And what are they going to think when he raises?

Mostly, these hands make me think, and I like that. They aren't always the line that I would take at first glance, but hey, he's playing for a living and I'm not, so I recognize there's a reason he's posting something like this, and I can probably learn something if I keep my mind open. (not a slam against SoBeDude personally, but more of a general response regarding Tommy posts.)

[SoBeDude]

When you look at a line of play, there are many things to consider. But the most important and overriding consideration is how to make the most money at the table.

Sometimes that's measured in terms of losing the least when we're behind in a hand, sometimes its that thin value bet on the river. And learning how to make the most money is the reason we all post on this forum.

And yes, sometimes playing a specific hand in a suboptimal way has metagame implications that actually help us make more money in the rest of the session.

But not finding a raise with top full is simply a mistake at the most fundamental level. It can't be explained or justified away.

You can make an argument for playing every street up to the river the way Tommy did, but you can't justify his river play. If Tommy really confident his opponent would bet the river, then check-raising the river is fine. If not he should have bet out. And once he checks and his opponent bets, he absolutely HAS to check-raise there.

-Scott