Live 5/5 Hand - playing AK on the flop

coltrane · #1 10-13-2004, 06:10 AM

5/5 NL - my stack is short at $500 - table has me covered

I haven't been at the table long, but every player seems pretty competent....

Preflop:
I have A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] in the SB....MP makes it $15 to go (this amount is more of a potbuilder at this table as opposed to a "raise")....two people behind him call....I decided to just call here and play a smaller, multiway pot.....I didn't want to make a big raise because I didn't want to have to play a big pot from up front if I didn't flop to it.....(anyone disagree with that last sentence?)...

Flop ($60):
A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I lead out for $60....one caller in LP - I have no read on him....

Turn ($180):
7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

what's my plan here?....easy check/fold?....bet out again and fold to any further action?....

by deciding to play a small, multiway pot am I pretty much resigning to the fact that I'm giving up a TPTK hand if I get played with?.....or does it depend on the board?....and on that board, am I pretty much shutting down after the flop if any diamond (or even a possible straight card) hits?.....

muzungu · #2 10-13-2004, 06:46 AM

Coltrane-

Preflop: Ya, with no reads on a table of basically decent players I would call this every time. Personally, I call AK from the blinds pretty much regardless of the table dynamic. If you are gonna raise, I think you need a good sense of the postflop dynamics of the table, which you do not have. No need to stick your neck out here.

Flop: I don't like leading out here. If you get called, you have a situation where the pot is 1/3 your stack, you have largely defined your hand, and there are a lot of scare cards. This is bad news. I'd prefer checking, the idea being:

If it is checked around, you will probably take it down if the turn blanks. If you get called there, you are closer to a showdown, which makes the river easier. If the turn is ugly, you are getting away for cheap.

If there is one flop bet, I like calling and leading out on a safe card (or maybe going for a c/r push, depending on your read on the villain.)

If there is a bet and a call or two (i.e. if the pot is big enough), I'd probably c/r all in. How much $ needs to be in there before the risk/reward is good for you is up to your discretion. Note that you might get calls here from AQ/etc, b/c your line looks like a big semibluff. You are only really screwed vs a set, so I think this could work out well.

Turn: ugh. Again, I don't like leading out, which screams "I am going to put in one more bet with my A and then fold". Go for the "I am going to just sit here and pretend I didn't just hit my flush" check. If they bet, maybe you fold, maybe you call and make them fire again on the river, maybe you push (not that I would do that, but just for the sake of argument...), but (again) this is a better range of choices than betting.

-muz

cornell2005 · #3 10-13-2004, 08:49 AM

agreed on all points. i rarely check/call then lead the turn if there is just one bettor but its not a bad play. someone gave me the link to a great thread yesterday where matt flynn posted some AK, TPTK thoughts. i pretty much try to avoid the raise pf, bet, bet line now, even on drawless boards. on this board its a no brainer, i wouldnt be the turn vs non-horrible players

TheGrifter · #4 10-13-2004, 08:56 AM

[ QUOTE ]
agreed on all points. i rarely check/call then lead the turn if there is just one bettor but its not a bad play. someone gave me the link to a great thread yesterday where matt flynn posted some AK, TPTK thoughts. i pretty much try to avoid the raise pf, bet, bet line now, even on drawless boards. on this board its a no brainer, i wouldnt be the turn vs non-horrible players

[/ QUOTE ]

Link?

cornell2005 · #5 10-13-2004, 09:15 AM

dont have it. i think maybe kerpowski gave it to me in the chat room but im not really sure. it was a thread called TPTK or something, and matt responded.

kerpowski · #6 10-13-2004, 11:21 AM

http://tinyurl.com/5c34a

Jester999 · #7 10-13-2004, 12:22 PM

Gracias for the link. That was some good stuff.

coltrane · #8 10-13-2004, 04:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]
agreed on all points. i rarely check/call then lead the turn if there is just one bettor but its not a bad play. ............. i wouldnt be the turn vs non-horrible players

[/ QUOTE ]

BK,

what line would you have taken in this situation?....same preflop?....check/call the flop?......then what?....

coltrane · #9 10-13-2004, 04:10 PM

Muz,

nice post....lots of good thoughts.....yeah, I was thinking (almost as soon as I bet) that I should've checked the flop.....if I check/call the flop though, I'm not sure about the old leading the turn on a blank thing....I think against a decent player I could get raised a lot there...I'd probably rather check/call or check/raise the turn - but I don't know, that's still the part I'm not sure of....

muzungu · #10 10-14-2004, 03:53 AM

coltrane-

1. The basic idea in betting out is that you are denying the flop bettor any free cards if he is on a draw. Of course, if you think he has a big A and that he will bet if you check (or that he will fire again with his draw instead of checking behind) feel free to check again with the intention of c/ring all in.

2. You said that "against a decent player I could get raised a lot there"- this is good for you. If the turn blanks you are still ahead of the majority of possible holdings. Your stack is small enough that you can get it all in here and be good in the long run, especially if you can elicit a big move from a wide range of holdings. If you think betting out will increase his willingness to play aggressively, then by all means do so.

-muz