Two Plus Two Older Archives  

Go Back   Two Plus Two Older Archives > General Poker Discussion > Poker Theory
FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-08-2004, 05:41 PM
Mojo, The Programmer Mojo, The Programmer is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Seattle-ish.
Posts: 17
Default A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

Hi all...

I've heard the term the "Gap" concept a few times on these forums...

What the heck is it?

Thanks!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-08-2004, 06:08 PM
CrisBrown CrisBrown is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,493
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

Hi Mojo,

The "Gap Concept" is introduced in Sklansky's Tournament Poker for Advanced Players, and it essentially says that you need a much better hand to call a raise than you would need to open raise yourself. This owes to survival equity in tournament play, that is, the value of not getting eliminated.

So while you might raise with AJ if you thought your opponents would fold (and you could steal the antes and blinds), you wouldn't call a raise with that sort of hand in most situations.

The "Gap Concept" expresses the value of aggression: you can raise with many hands (or nearly any hand, depending on the situation), but you don't want to call unless you have a very strong holding or very good implied odds, or both.

Cris
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-08-2004, 06:49 PM
jedi jedi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 517
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

Also, the "Gap Concept" applies to all poker situations, not just in tournaments. However the Gap tends to be bigger in tournaments because of the survival factor.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-18-2004, 01:21 PM
CarlSpackler CarlSpackler is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 123
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

If I’m not mistaken, another important principle of the Gap Concept is that the size of the gap is different throughout a tournament. With regards to the AJ example, early in a tournament in late position when faced with a raise, you would want to fold this most of the time, but with no raise in front of you, you would generally raise with this hand. The Gap here would be rather large. In the same situation late in a tournament, however, when faced with an all-in raise by a short stack, the gap is much smaller, and you would want to call more often in this scenario. This is because late in a tournament, the blinds are very big, and the number of hands the small stack will raise all-in with in this situation increase significantly, because he doesn’t have time to wait around for a premium hand, or he’ll get blinded to death.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-17-2004, 05:59 PM
Ivan Garp Ivan Garp is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 2
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

Hi,

You can read more about the Gap Concept on http://www.pokerlistings.com/poker-s...he-gap-concept but the book Tournament Poker by sklansky, where the Gap Concept first was mention is worth reading.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-17-2004, 07:14 PM
Kurn, son of Mogh Kurn, son of Mogh is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Cranston, RI
Posts: 4,011
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

Despite what others have said, the Gap Concept didn't originate in TPFAP. It's a concept common to all poker that long pre-existed TPFAP.

Simply put, it means that you need a stronger hand to call a raise than you need to raise yourself. No more, no less. Any more detailed discussion would be analysis on how to put the concept to use in a game situation.

For example, UTG, you would open-raise with AQo, but if you were in MP and a decent player open-raised from UTG, your best play would be to throw AQo away.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-18-2004, 01:28 AM
CrisBrown CrisBrown is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,493
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

Hi Kurn,

Agreed that the Gap Concept pre-exists the description of it in TPFAP. I'm not sure if that particular name first appeared in TPFAP or not, but obviously the concept existed before Sklansky described it.

Cris
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-18-2004, 12:16 AM
Deorum Deorum is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Northern California
Posts: 68
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

The Gap Concept says you need a stronger hand with which to
call a bet than you need to make a bet in the same
situation. Everyone so far has described it as needing a
better hand to call a raise or make a raise, but that is
not true. It applies to all bets, not just raises. The
basic theory behind the Gap Concept is this: if you make
the bet yourself, you have two ways to win. The first is
that nobody will call, and the second is that you can show
down the best hand. If you are calling instead of betting,
you only have one way to win: to show down the best hand.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-18-2004, 12:29 PM
jedi jedi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 517
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

[ QUOTE ]
Everyone so far has described it as needing a
better hand to call a raise or make a raise, but that is
not true. It applies to all bets, not just raises.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, as Sklansky once described it, a bet is just a raise of a bet of 0.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-18-2004, 05:35 AM
Rusty266 Rusty266 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 23
Default Re: A Question: What the heck is the \"Gap Concept\"

Yeah well, here's my take. Its true that you need a better hand to call with when someone has raised ahead of you. Big deal, no great relevation there, everyone knows that.

But thats the point.

Everyone does know that. The idea of the gap concept in tournament play is to take advantage of that situation.

The difference between a hand that you would call a raiser with and the hand you would raise yourself with is the "gap".

In a tournament, you should be willing to raise with hands that would be considered inferior, if someone else had already raised.

With a raise and a call ahead of you, you might opt to fold a hand like Qs-Js. But from middle to late position with no one else in the pot yet, it becomes a hand you should raise with.

By being the raiser, the pressure is now on the players left to act, and their requirements for playing their hand have now gone up, because someone has raised ahead of them. Because of the "gap" they may very well fold hands that are superior to yours, K-Q or even A-J for example.

Bacause of the "gap" you avoid confrontations with the players ahead of you that have already raised and shown some strength. Thats a pretty common thought process and common way of playing.

What is not as common is using that information to your benefit by raising with more hands when no strength is shown ahead of you, trying to apply the pressure to the players that act after you. Players who are trying to preserve their chips, and now, because you have raised, must elevate their hand requirements when deciding whether or not to call.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.