I love poker, but I have a gambling problem (Long).

[Johnny123]

Okay, so now I admitted it. I have a gambling problem. I'm posting here, hoping that someone could provide some ideas on how I should deal with this problem.

Here is my situation:

1. My life is, frankly, rather dull at the moment. I work part-time. I have too much time on my own. I spend a lot of time in front of my computer.

2. I play a lot of poker, and make money doing it. I am by no means a great poker player, but I am a consistent winner at microlimits and small stakes.

3. I whore casino bonuses. I use big bets to clear the bonuses fast.


I think that my problem basically is this: I find it hard to resist gambling. I sometimes don't quit when I should. I often take stupid risks, such as a $100 wager in blackjack hoping to get back to even after having lost lots of $5 bets. I sometimes become indifferent to a big poker loss, letting it become even bigger by sloppy play.

More and more often, I start to compulsively chasing losses. I know it's stupid. I know I should leave the poker table when I'm playing poorly. I know it's -EV to keep playing at a casino after clearing the bonus. Some months ago, these things did not happen very often. But now they do.

Today I blew $1350 at an online casino AFTER clearing the bonus. A few hours later, I did a similar thing at another casino. And this is a lot of money to me, so it's quite a big deal. I can do things such as telling myselt that if I am up $100, I'll quit. Then when I am up $100, I still don't quit. Then I lose, and think that "No matter what, I will not let my balance drop below $400." And then it drops below $400. And I still don't quit.

It's not like this happens everytime I gamble, but it happens and that's bad enough. I feel really bad afterwards, like some stupid, worthless addict.

When it's blackjack I get a big kick out of making big wagers, and sometimes I just can't stop myself from doing it.

When it's poker these things does not happen as often, but sometimes I keep playing far too long when I'm stuck and/or steaming, and sometimes I keep playing for a completely different reason - that I don't care. I sit with my stack and know that I'll probably lose it all. And I don't care.


So, what should I do about this? I know I gamble too much at the moment, but I don't want to stop completely. I like poker a lot, the strategy aspects, the psychology, the maths etc. And it has become a source of income that I more or less rely on at the moment, since I don't make that much money at my part-time job.

Maybe I should stop doing casino bonuses, but then again it's +EV and very easy money. Despite my crazy losses, I have still made a few thousand dollar through this.

I would simply like to be able to gamble rationally. Which I usually am. But then it happens, perhaps after a week of solid, winning poker play, I go on supertilt again and lose half of what I had won that week through sheer stupidity. And tell myself that this was the last time. But I know in my heart that it isn't. And I would like that to change.

I don't want to talk to an organization such as GA (although I have seriously considered it) since I don't want to stop gambling. I have been thinking about seeing a therapist for this. Some years ago, I saw a therapist for other problems, and that helped.

I am going to take a week off from all non-poker gambling right now. And after that week, I have promised myself not to wager more than $10 on any one hand when playing blackjack. And to always try to stay focused and controlled when I play poker. Try to go back to what I used to be able to do, which was focusing on studying and improving my play rather than short term results. I'm convinced that I need to do these things for the sake of my bankroll and sanity, but I do not think that it's enough to overcome my problems.

So.. if any of you who bothered to read this has any thoughts about what I should to, I would appreciate your comments. Thanks.

[the_rookie]

Yup, you have a gambling problem. It's good that you're able to identify the problem before something drastic happens. You need to quit poker and stay away from casinos period.

You said that you spend most of your time in front of your computer and that isn't healthy. Go fishing, watch a movie, get laid, but do something other than staring at the computer screen all day.

I hope you reconsider seeing a therapist as that is clearly the best choice for you.

Good luck, bro.

[Johnny123]

I realized I was going to get these "Go to GA and stop gambling period" replies. And while I do respect and understand your opinion I don't think I need to do that.

Maybe I need to quit casino games (including promotions and other +EV opportunities). That is possible. But poker? No, I don't think so. Perhaps I wasn't clear enough in my original post, but 95% of the time I play solid winning poker. Not world-class poker, but good enough to beat the internet lowlimits. Combining the poker bonuses and poker playing, I make sligthly more playing poker than at my job. I like it and I make money out of it.

I started playing poker because of the money. I had heard that the players on Party Poker were horrible and that it was easy money. To my surprise I got really interested in the strategy aspects - there was so much more to the game than I would have imagined. I used to read poker books all the time and think about the strategy aspects, and (honestly!) not very much about the gambling aspects. In the beinning I was a breakeven player at Party 0.5/1. Then I got better, and after a few good months I realized I was a winning microlimit player. I started playing 1/2 and 2/4, and kept winning.

Then, gradually, things changed to the worse. I kept thinking more and more about the short-term results. My emotional control when playing got much worse. Still, I only tilt away money a small percentage of the time I play poker, but it happens. And I know I'm far too results-oriented. I don't study the game as much as I use to, because I think it's more fun to play, and I have poor self-disciplne.

I think this has three causes:

1. I have an addictive-compulsive personality. I easily get "too much into" things, if you know what I mean.

2. My life is boring at the moment, and I wanted excitement.

3. The casino games has shrewed my sense for money. After winning or losing a few hundred dollars in half and hour, the money in a $2/$4 limit hold'em seems like nothing. The reckless, tilty sessions has become far more common after I took up casinowhoring.

So.. if you got the impression that I have no control when playing poker, that was wrong. I usually have decent emotional control and I am a winning player overall. But I feel that I need more emotional control when playing poker.

Blackjack, however, is another story. I feel that I am close to becoming addicted to it. And that's not about the strategy. It's abouth the gambling. The excitement and the money. And I hate it. Maybe I need to quit doing it, maybe I can keep playing for the bonuses as long I can restraint myself from taking stupid risks. I'm not sure. We'll see.

I have promised myself not too play any casino games for money this week. I will not be playing any poker until wednesday (Party Reload bonus) becaue I realize that I need to take a step back from this to gain perspective. We'll see what happens after that.

[Derek in NYC]

1. Quit casino games.
2. Play poker on a dedicated bankroll, and stay within adequate risk limits
3. Set aside 1 day a week for study (books, Pokertracker, 2+2 catchup, whatever)
4. Set poker goals and work to achieve them
5. Limit your play by hand count

This is what I do. #4 is particularly helpful. My goal is to spend the entire year playing 5/10SH and demonstrate a 2.5 BB/100 win rate over 100k hands before moving up. My live play goal is to move exclusively to 10/20 and stop screwing around at lower limit games. I find these goals challenging, and it helps to keep my poker more disciplined.

[Johnny123]

Good advice. But I'm not sure I understood #5. Do you mean that I should stop playing after having played a certain number of hands? If so, why?

I will definitely do 2-4. Tomorrow will be my study day of this week. (Today I will try to do as little as possible related to gambling, except for reading and posting in this thread.) I will seriously consider no. 1. I'll give myself a last chance next week. If I ever find myself betting more than $10 on one single hand, or keep playing after having cleared the bonus, I'll quit blackjack period.

I will also have to deal with my lack of self-discipline in general (yes, in general, not just related to gambling). I ordered some book on the subject that seems good. And I will seriously consider going back to therapy to work on my lack of self-discipline and any other emotional problems I might have, that causes me to take foolish risks.

[Derek in NYC]

[ QUOTE ]
Good advice. But I'm not sure I understood #5. Do you mean that I should stop playing after having played a certain number of hands? If so, why?

[/ QUOTE ]

Your problem seems to be that you set unrealistic win expectations, and also that you find it psychologically difficult to stop if you are losing (and indeed, that you take risk maximizing strategies such as doubling the stakes to "make up" for when you are losing).

I can sympathize. When I am running hot, it is very exciting to me, and when I am stuck, I tend to play too long in order to try to get back to even. (I do not, however, step up in limits.) This is fairly common behavior, I think, and most players feel this way to some extent.

Theoretically, if you were perfectly emotionally controlled, you should make the decision about when to leave/stay based exclusively on table conditions (e.g., presence of donators, current table image, whether you are on your A-game, whether you are tired, who is the sucker, etc.)

If you are incapable of taking the theoretically correct course of action, you need to set artificial limits such as 500 hands a day, 4 hours of play, one buy-in, etc. External limits will minimize both your upswings and downswings, but hopefully they will prevent you from steaming away your bankroll in 1 session. Since emotions cool down over time, this strategy should lower your variance.

I found Improve Your Poker and Inside the Poker Mind to contain some helpful thoughts on self-control. I generally found Psychology of Poker to be less helpful as a book, but that is because I tend to play a tight-aggressive game, and engage in pretty constant self-criticism.

External risk limits exist all the time in the real world and serve as effective countermeasures when emotional/irrational factors are driving behavior. For example, the stock exchanges have circuit breakers that will trigger and stop trading after a certain amount of movement. This will slow a market crash, and allow market participants to digest information, analzye, and hopefully make trading decisions based on a rational process rather than an emotional need. Yes, markets are efficient in the long term, but in the short term, they are not. So external risk limits help keep markets from overreacting.

[ChicagoTroy]

That you win at poker is not the issue. It takes up an unhealthy amount of your time and energy.

[cianosheehan]

I would seriously recommend joining a martial arts class. Doing something physically and mentally demanding and completely different to poker/gambling will help your situation a lot. Also you will be meeting new people, getting out of the house etc. I say martial arts as opposed to other activities because martial arts is excellent for teaching self discipline.

to be honest, it sounds like you need to get out of your head...less thought more action. Do it...do it!!

[galahad_187]

I had a similar problem a while ago. I had a lucky weekend and won 2grand playing roulette using this 'system'. Pretty soon i'm playing these -EV casino games non stop acually believing these 'systems' are true. Long story short i had put a total of 4grand for online gambling(about). and was down to (about) 500 bucks from another decient few days. then i switched to poker. I first read several books in B&N and kept at it. I went down to about 200 bucks where i stayed for quite sometime, then i rose up up up. Now i make about 18-22$/hr 8 tabling 25nl 6 max games, and i'll have my 4grand fully recovered within 2 weeks (assuming no severe cold deck)

I know the sting of gambling, it was a total high thinking i was set and could rape casinos, i did the exact same things as you. 'common baby get back to 500 and i'll walk 500 and i'll walk' 550 hits and im saying 'common just 150 more and im done.'

its a horrid cycle. I blasted all the casino software from my computer and kept at poker. Poker is a gamblers best friend if you can be well disciplined about it. I know 2 things helped me a great deal along the way. 1) my gym time. I had been going toa gym for 2 years at the time and with out it i would ahve probably broken things. 2) my girlfriend. While it doesn't need to be someone of the opposite sex exactly, just going away somewhere that doesn't have anything to do with gambling or your money in general is a great thing.

godspeed to you

[Johnny123]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Svar till:</font><hr />
That you win at poker is not the issue. It takes up an unhealthy amount of your time and energy.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. I need to get more balance in my life. I seriously do not think that I need to quit poker, but maybe I should take a break from it. That would probably be a good thing to do. In any case, I should find more non-gambling things to do and spend less time playing and thinking about poker.

I have always liked poker as a strategy game, and am not very carried away about the money/gambling aspect of it. I believe that is because I can never win or lose a lot on one single hand, or one short session. It's not at all like blackjack, where you can win or lose any set amount within seconds.

As for casino games (blackjack etc), they are the devil. I don't really like playing them, it's more that I sometimes can't get away from it when I have started. It's a completely different feeling than poker (at least for me). I like the highs and hate the lows, but hate the lows A LOT more than I like the highs. It's just not worth it. I'm quitting all those games. I realize that I can't just "play for fun" or "occasionally clear a bonus and then quit" or anything like that when it comes to such games. My life would be better without them. So, no more blackjack or other casino games for me.

Poker is different. I never feel "damnit, I gotta make a big score... it would be so great to win lots of money fast!" or something like that when playing poker. I just try to make the correct decisions. Sure, I sometimes deviate from that due to frustration and have a tilty session. And that is a problem. But I think I know myself good enough to know that this might get better. With experience, will to change and a more balanced life. And perhaps some therapy. In anyone here has any experience from cognitive therapy, feel free to drop me a pm about it (or post here).