Quick preflop question

[cosmo kramer]

3-6 B&M. Game is loose as always and passive for the most part. I'm in the $1 SB with 56 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. UTG calls, UTG+1 raises, he's cold-called by the CO and button. Before I've had a chance to act, the BB and UTG call the raise. Therefore, I'm getting 6-1 on my call closing the action. Is this a call or fold?

[MarkD]

For me this is a fold due to relative position to the raiser and absolute position wrt betting position on all rounds. Not to mention I dislike playing 56s for two bets and the $1 blind doesn't entice me much.

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
For me this is a fold due to relative position to the raiser

[/ QUOTE ]


maybe I'm wrong, but isn't this a positive in this hand? Either he's going to flop a monster and want to pump the pot, or he's going to fold. If he flops 2 pair, he can bet and hope UTG+1 raises for him. If he flops a good draw, he can check-raise, trapping most of the field for extra bets.

[MarkD]

You're right. I didn't give it enough thought, but I would rather have him immediately to my left or immediately to my right instead of having the two players in between.

I intuitively am going to fold this because it's 2 bets with 56s out of position on all streets and the relative position didn't seem ideal to me, but on that point I am wrong since I now see multiple ways of getting 2 bets out of 3 opponents on the flop. I still don't like calling here but that's just me.

This would be a call in the BB or a call with a different SB structure for me.

[sthief09]

I fold. Suited connectors suck. Your odds aren't bad, and your position relative to the PF raiser is good for pumping the pot, but your implied odds are hurt because the pot is big and you're out of position.

I think this is somewhat close, and I have a feeling some people might disagree with me, but I really am starting to think that suited connectors just aren't good.

[MarkD]

[ QUOTE ]
but your implied odds are hurt because the pot is big and you're out of position


[/ QUOTE ]
This isn't right. The pot being big doesn't hurt your implied odds, calling two bets does. Being out of position also hurts them.

[sthief09]

If you're paying twice as much to call preflop, then you need twice as many bets to make up for what you're giving up on the flop. So your implied odds must be about twice as much as they would if he had called for just one back.

[MarkD]

Right. I agree completely. That's what I said. (But, not what you said originally).

[LetsRock]

IMO, the problem with this hand is that you have to have a very strong flop to feel like the hand is yours. Even 2 pair would be difficult to push because you could be beat by a set with the third card. Even if you flop a flush, can you be certain that you're not up against bit suited cards from somewhere else? Sure you have potential, but it would be difficult to extract enough to have high expectations of getting good implied odds. Uless you get a straight draw, trips or better on the flop, it would be very hard to get full value from this hand in EP.

With this blind structure, I'd probably let them go. If it was a 50% (or more) small blind, I'd probably call because now your odds are much better and it's worth looking for tht "perfect" flop.

[PokerBob]

IMO this REALLY depends on the other players at the table. Are they "normal" loose (may cold call 2 bets PF w/ATo) or "retarded" loose (will call 2 cold with 72s). It is worth the call if they will go too far with their hands and pay you off when you hit yours.

IMO position is not as important here as others have stated. If I miss the flop I am gone, and if I hit it (4-flush or OESD) I can comfortably check and assume it will get bet, even semi-bluff bet it myself.