To Chris, Cyrus and anyone else

that supports homicide bombings, I am curious:


1. What are your views on the September 11th attacks? Do you feel there was any justification for the attacks?


2. What about the kidnapping and murder of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl? Was that action justified?

Where did either of them say that they supported homicide bombings?


Just curious.


Matt

Matt,


Thats not a quote, thats from multiple postings (mainly from Chris Alger) justifying/ rationalizing the homicide bombings, and even blaming Israel and (more specifically) Sharon for them.


IMO, there is no justification for such acts. To try to justify or rationalize such actions is insane. To place the blame for them on anyone but the terrorists themselves and the people/organizations which support them is equally insane.

B-Man,


I agree with you: there's no way a sane person can rationalize/justify the deliberate killing of innocent people. The person who loads up a backpack with explosives or straps C-4 to his chest and walks into a bar and detonates himself is solely responsible for his own actions. These are heinous crimes and they need to stop.


As Andy pointed out, there is a history behind everything that's happening today. Is that rationalization/justification to blow up innocents? Nope. I think what Chris and Cyrus are trying to point out here is that the crimes throughout histroy are not one-sided. To turn an earlier thread around where Chris and KJS and others were called to task for expressing their outrage at the Israeli leveling of the apartment building but not at the homicide bombings: there is incredible outrage with Palestinian terrorism, with homicide bombers and the deliberate targeting of civilians. Rightly so. But where is the outrage at over 50 years of oppression that is still ongoing? I think that's a big part of what Chris and Cyrus are trying to say. (Now, I have no desire to get into an argument about who has been worse and which crime is greater. It's like arguing which is worse, rape or murder. They're both wrong. Arguing about degrees is to miss the whole picture.)


There's a lot of interesting and thought-provoking information in each of their posts (not to say there is no such information in other people's posts). I'm not saying you have to agree with them. I'm not even saying I agree with them. Maybe I do, maybe I don't. Point is, it's information. Don't just dismiss it out of hand or write it off as terrorist propaganda just because you don't agree/don't like the person who posted it. If you think it's wrong, prove it. (I'm not just talking to you specifically, B-Man. That's a "you" general not "you" specific.)


Anyway, that's my 2 cents on the matter, or 50-cent piece, or whatever. [img]/images/smile.gif[/img]


Matt

"thats from multiple postings (mainly from Chris Alger) justifying/ rationalizing the homicide bombings"


Well, with all those multiple postings out there you should be able to find some word or words that supports this claim. So are you being dishonest or lazy?

I don't think that Chris and Cyrus (or anyone else who has posted here) support homicide bombings. They have pointed out that the bombings don't occur in a vacuum, that there is a history behind current events that explains, but does not justify, the bombings. People have a reason for doing things. If those reasons are ignored, then the cycle of violence will continue and probably spiral out of control (if it hasn't already). To just say that the other side is evil, that they are wrong and we are right, that we are good and they are evil, leads to stalemate and war. This is exactly the attitude of Messers Arafat and Sharon and the reason why, IMO, they should depart from the scene. Neither has shown the courage or statemanship necessary to stop the burying of Palestinian and Jewish children.


The deliberate killing of civilians is never justified. The September 11 attacks and the murder of Mr. Pearl sicken and disgust me. The Palestinian homicide bombers sicken and disgust me.


It seems clear to me that there would be no Palestinian homicide bombers if the Jews had treated the Palestinians with any degree of respect since the fouding of Zionism. To ignore this history is to be condemned to repeat it. I have no doubt that Zionism's founders would be ashmamed of the history of Zionism, and the founders of Palestinian nationalism should be ashamed of the course it has taken as well.

Many interesting points Andy.


There is one point I would like to make which seems to escape many on this forum. It is that REGARDLESS of who is right or wrong historically, and to whatever degree each may share blame, that homicide bombings of innocents are 100% wrong, no matter WHY they originated or who was originally at fault. The world simply cannot tolerate the existence and perpetuation of a philosophy that says those who are dissatisfied may attack innocents instead of attacking those they perceive as the guilty or responsible parties.


As loony as McVeigh was, he had zero business attacking a federal building where common federal workers were the most likely to be killed. He was not attacking the individuals he had his gripes with/about; he was merely attacking a symbol of them (and killing very real innocents in the process). So whether it is the Palestinians, al Qaeda, the IRA, or any other terrorist group or individual, the philosophy that attacking innocents in order to prove a point or to draw attention to an issue is so wrong and dangerous it must be considered intolerable in the eyes of the rest of the world (if civilization is to survive as weapons of destruction continually increase in power).


In other words, the world must stamp out terrorism, regardless of any "justification" terrorists caim. If oppressed peoples believe they have a just cause that requires violence, then let the violence be directed primarily at the responsible parties, not at the innocent uninvolved members of society. Terrorism must be stopped ASAP in all forms and by all groups before it gains even more widespread acceptance as a philosophy. It is this which Alger and Cyrus seem to fail to realize, because although they condemn terrorism, they keep pointing to what they see as the underlying causes of Palestinian terrorism. I agree there are many underlying causes and that some of these could be addressed, but I state emphatically that the world cannot allow the widespread acceptance of terroristic philosophy and actions because that will eventually doom the human race (as weapons of greater and greater destructive powers are inevitably developed as decades pass).