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Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
I am a libertarian. I am also a Christian. I read the following in the Dallas Morning News Letters today:
I am outraged at the hypocrisy of the Christian right. Christmas is about doing good things for others and remembering and caring for those in our society who have less. Who did Christ first witness to in his mission on earth? The rich? No. It was the poor, the outcasts and unwanted in society. Is the Christian right concerned about those people in our society? Obviously not, according to their stand on affordable health care for all Americans, education and Social Security. This is what Christ would have been preaching about if he came today, not whether retailers and Christmas cards say "Happy holidays." Have we embraced and cared for those in our society who can't speak for themselves? Health care, education, affordable housing and decent wages – these are the moral, social issues of our time that will show Christ that we have kept his name in Christmas. Now...I find myself at a bit of a juxtaposition. I don't agree with the leftist bent of the letter. I think it's pretty much boiler-plate liberaltalk. But, it made me wonder: would Christ, if He were walking around today, be a liberal? Would He really support social programs, caring for the poor, national healthcare, etc.? To take it a step further, is my campaigning against these things at odds with my faith? I am not a member of the Christian right by any means, so I don't have the "balancing" notions of protecting morality and decency(like the Parents Television Council crowd, or Jerry Falwell). So, am I acting against my creed in standing up for reduced aid to the poor, privatization of healthcare, and the abolition of welfare and Social Security? I apologize if this is shading into the philosophy forum area, but I trust you guys for even-keeled responses more than those folks... [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] |
#2
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
[ QUOTE ]
But, it made me wonder: would Christ, if He were walking around today, be a liberal? Would He really support social programs, caring for the poor, national healthcare, etc.? [/ QUOTE ] I think He would. |
#3
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
would Christ, if He were walking around today, be a liberal? Would He really support social programs, caring for the poor, national healthcare, etc.?
As a non-religious libertarian who has studied religion, while its easy for me to make a flip remark equating Jesus' message as socialism, I don't necessarily think that the concept of "Christian Charity" presupposes government involvement. I think you can be in favor of helping the less fortunate and still be opposed to the government forcing everyone to do so. I see no contradiction. |
#4
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
[ QUOTE ]
I think you can be in favor of helping the less fortunate and still be opposed to the government forcing everyone to do so. [/ QUOTE ] Ding! Someone else brought up the "render unto ceasar what is ceasar's" quote. I'm no biblical scholar, but couldn't this also be taken to mean that Christians should do their ministry and let government do government stuff? |
#5
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I think you can be in favor of helping the less fortunate and still be opposed to the government forcing everyone to do so. [/ QUOTE ] Ding! Someone else brought up the "render unto ceasar what is ceasar's" quote. I'm no biblical scholar, but couldn't this also be taken to mean that Christians should do their ministry and let government do government stuff? [/ QUOTE ] "Interpret" it all you like, Jesus said what he said. Just because it's politically inconvenient for you doesn't change its meaning or give you the authority to rewrite it to better suit your own political agenda. I watch people on the right wing do this all the time, though. They claim to be "Christians" -- literally "followers of Christ" -- but whereever Jesus said something that they don't want to submit to, they just "interpret" it to mean whatever their personal politics demands of them. I find it fascinating that such people still think of themselves as "Christians", since it's clear that when they have to choose between Jesus' actual teachings and their own predispositions, their own predispositions take precedence every time. q/q |
#6
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
[ QUOTE ]
Just because it's politically inconvenient for you doesn't change its meaning or give you the authority to rewrite it to better suit your own political agenda. [/ QUOTE ] Pay your taxes, effectively. Hey, I pay mine. I don't see where Jesus said "force others to pay taxes." He said "do unto others as you would have done to you." I don't know many people that like being forced to do things. I certainly don't. But I do know lots of people (including myself) that like being helped. Therefore, I should help others, but not force other people to do things they don't want to do. |
#7
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
[ QUOTE ]
I am a libertarian. I am also a Christian. I read the following in the Dallas Morning News Letters today: I am outraged at the hypocrisy of the Christian right. Christmas is about doing good things for others and remembering and caring for those in our society who have less. Who did Christ first witness to in his mission on earth? The rich? No. It was the poor, the outcasts and unwanted in society. Is the Christian right concerned about those people in our society? Obviously not, according to their stand on affordable health care for all Americans, education and Social Security. This is what Christ would have been preaching about if he came today, not whether retailers and Christmas cards say "Happy holidays." Have we embraced and cared for those in our society who can't speak for themselves? Health care, education, affordable housing and decent wages – these are the moral, social issues of our time that will show Christ that we have kept his name in Christmas. Now...I find myself at a bit of a juxtaposition. I don't agree with the leftist bent of the letter. I think it's pretty much boiler-plate liberaltalk. But, it made me wonder: would Christ, if He were walking around today, be a liberal? Would He really support social programs, caring for the poor, national healthcare, etc.? To take it a step further, is my campaigning against these things at odds with my faith? I am not a member of the Christian right by any means, so I don't have the "balancing" notions of protecting morality and decency(like the Parents Television Council crowd, or Jerry Falwell). So, am I acting against my creed in standing up for reduced aid to the poor, privatization of healthcare, and the abolition of welfare and Social Security? I apologize if this is shading into the philosophy forum area, but I trust you guys for even-keeled responses more than those folks... [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] An article that may help explain why organized religion competes with the welfare state I'll attempt to summarize as succinctly as possible: 1) economic insecurity/life unpredictability = robust and widespread appeal of organized/traditional religion 2) the welfare state attempts to curb economic insecurity/life unpredictability – that is, the welfare state (inadvertently and indirectly) secularizes modern society 3) ergo, the welfare state weakens the influence of religious institutions -- in some way placing organized religion in direct competition with the modern welfare state...and hence why organized religions like Christianity and polticial philosophies like libertarianism share similar ends and interests, and are therefore not incongruent. However, as the article also mentions: rigid, predictable rules are an almost universal characteristic of all organized religions, which may explain why there is some inherent conflict between libertarians and religions like Christianity -- a conflict you seem to have an intuitive sense of. In other words, as you note: there are some ways in which libertarianism (that is, more correctly, an anti-welfare state position) is entirely consistent with the interests of Christianity; yet in other ways, libertarianism lies in conflict with the unyielding ethical paradigms of most organized and traditional religions. I'm sure I wasn't particularly clear here, but it's the best I could do while 4-tabling/trying to buy last-minute Christmas gifts online; but I hope I was able to capture why you might feel conflicted about being both a libertarian and a Christian, as there seems to be some amount of empirical evidence that validates the notion that the modern welfare state (seemingly anathama to libertarians) conflicts with organized religion. --------------------------------------------- For those curious about the methodology behind the survey results cited in the article |
#8
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
Jesus advocated giving to the poor, but Jesus did not advocate forcing others to give to the poor.
Jesus told the rich man what he could do if he truly wanted to follow him. When instead the rich man walked away (rather than give all his treasures to the poor), Jesus let him. From this, it appears that Jesus regarded the giving of charity as something each person is to decide for himself. |
#9
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
Let's not confuse Jesus with Christianity.
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#10
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Re: Is libertarianism at odds with Christianity?
[ QUOTE ]
Let's not confuse Jesus with Christianity. [/ QUOTE ] lol. zing |
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