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#1
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Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
This is the same table as my AKs post. The button is the loose-passive preflop, but aggressive post flop player from before. The BB appears to be tight-aggressive preflop and passive post flop and UTG+1 seems to be a bit loose passive, but has only been at the table a dozen or so hands.
Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, Button calls, Hero completes, BB checks. Flop: (4 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font> Hero checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>... First is the preflop limp too weak? I likely would have lost the BB with a raise, but I am out of position and going to be facing at least two opponents so I figured just completeing was better. What does everyone think of the flop raise? I figured the button could be betting almost any hand here. If you like the raise do you fold to a re-raise by any of the opponents. If they call do you bet the turn if you still don't improve? |
#2
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
I would probably raise preflop and lead this flop.
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#3
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
[ QUOTE ]
I would probably raise preflop and lead this flop. [/ QUOTE ] Both those are incorrect. |
#4
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
Why? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]
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#5
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
Maybe I should give my reasoning first. Preflop, against 2 limpers, I think AQo is a huge favorite so I want to put money into the pot while I'm winning. I think this makes up for the crappy position we have at this point. Plus I could knock out the BB and put some dead money in the middle.
On the flop (assuming that I had raised) I would want to lead because I have 3 outs to catch an A, a backdoor flush and a backdoor straight draw. It's even possible that the unimproved AQ is the best hand right now. Even if I don't improve on the turns, the K on the board might scare the limpers into folding the flop. |
#6
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
I don't like the preflop raise because we're out of position. Why put extra bets in when the only way we're playing past the flop is if we hit? Put in the minimum and we'll have these limpers dominated if a Q or A is on the flop (which means they'll put in extra bets against us).
Also, betting into 3 opponents with one overcard and a paired board is very dangerous. Its to easy to get raised behind and end up paying extra to see the turn when we could easily be drawing dead anyway. However, if we were last to act, this would be an easy bet. The check-raise here is interesting, I'd only do it if I knew the button was a habitual bluffer but a weakie at heart. Otherwise I wait for another hand to try something fancy like this. |
#7
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
Thanks for the response. A couple of questions...
[ QUOTE ] I don't like the preflop raise because we're out of position. Why put extra bets in when the only way we're playing past the flop is if we hit? Put in the minimum and we'll have these limpers dominated if a Q or A is on the flop (which means they'll put in extra bets against us). [/ QUOTE ] This is how I used to rationalize limping with AK in my (more) weak tight days. Is AQ that much worse of a hand in this early position (even against 2 party .5-1.00 limpers)? [ QUOTE ] Also, betting into 3 opponents with one overcard and a paired board is very dangerous. Its to easy to get raised behind and end up paying extra to see the turn when we could easily be drawing dead anyway. However, if we were last to act, this would be an easy bet. [/ QUOTE ] When the board pairs like this I usually assume it is much less likely for someone to be holding one of the last 4s. Also 4 is a very low card. If there was a pair of Ts on the board, I would be more afraid (people are more willing to limp with JT than J4). Another thing -- a lot of these players will wait until the turn to raise if they do have a 4. If the turn comes a blank, we can easily check-fold. (Although if we catch an A, we are a bit screwed). [ QUOTE ] The check-raise here is interesting, I'd only do it if I knew the button was a habitual bluffer but a weakie at heart. Otherwise I wait for another hand to try something fancy like this. [/ QUOTE ] Agreed. Thoughts? |
#8
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
[ QUOTE ]
The check-raise here is interesting, I'd only do it if I knew the button was a habitual bluffer but a weakie at heart. Otherwise I wait for another hand to try something fancy like this. [/ QUOTE ] Does he have to be a habitual bluffer? Aggressive post flop players will often bet this hand from the button not because they are bluffing, but because they think they probably have the best hand even if they missed on the flop. |
#9
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
[ QUOTE ]
I don't like the preflop raise because we're out of position. Why put extra bets in when the only way we're playing past the flop is if we hit? Put in the minimum and we'll have these limpers dominated if a Q or A is on the flop (which means they'll put in extra bets against us). [/ QUOTE ] I didnt see your argument when I posted, we were writting at the same time =). I don't know, I dont like giving the bb a free look at the board when i have a good hand. I would rather them fold than let them see the flop for free with 84 and make me draw into two backdoor draws. Well that doesn't always happen, it is probable enough that I rarely slowplay anything because I would rather occasionally steal the blinds than let other players outdraw me for free. |
#10
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Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
You only complete AQo out of the SB, and only bet if an A or a Q hit the flop? I don't like that play at all. With 4 players, how good is your hand?
I raise that preflop. On this flop, I bet out, call a raise, and wait for the turn. [edit] Just saw your reply...you're not raising to push people out, you're raising for value. |
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