Conservative TT hand.

Jeff W · #1 07-09-2005, 08:40 PM

MP1 is a passive player--20/6/1.0 over 250 hands.
Don't remember reads on other players.

Preflop: Jeff W is SB with Th, Tc.
3 folds, MP1 raises, 1 fold, MP3 calls, 2 folds, Jeff W calls, BB calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 3s, 3c, 9c (4 players)
Jeff W checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks.

Turn: (4 BB) Ah (4 players)
Jeff W checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks.

River: (4 BB) 4s (4 players)
Jeff W bets.

brettbrettr · #2 07-09-2005, 08:44 PM

Considering MP's passivity I think you have to bet that flop.

sinfulslick18 · #3 07-09-2005, 08:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Considering MP's passivity I think you have to bet that flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Jeff W · #4 07-09-2005, 09:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Considering MP's passivity I think you have to bet that flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

I still expect MP to bet this flop. That he didn't was a surprise. Betting doesn't protect my hand.

blackize · #5 07-09-2005, 09:12 PM

If you aren't willing to bet the flop why are you betting the river. What will MP call you with that you beat? Given that he is 20/6 you can almost be assured he is raising AK AQ QQ KK and AA and thats about it. Given that his aggression is 1 you probably dont have much fold equity either. So all in all, I fail to see what this bet accomplishes.

brettbrettr · #6 07-09-2005, 11:23 PM

I'm not sure you're protecting your hand inasmuch as you're betting with the best of it.

Brunger · #7 07-09-2005, 09:24 PM

I can't imagine what MP1 could have unless he misclicked a raise or is weirdly playing AA. Was your plan to check-raise the flop? Also are you folding to a turn bet. I like the river bet because you are going to call and can easily fold to a raise.

blackize · #8 07-09-2005, 10:52 PM

Why do you like the river bet? He is betting into 3 other players one of whom has a 6% PFR and happened to have raised this hand. Against 3 other players he will only be called when he is behind, and I imagine that MP1 has QQ+ and will call a bet on the river as well as the fact that the BB or MP3 likely has an ace with a weak kicker and will also call.

I feel the river bet accomplishes nothing except to lose money.

Brunger · #9 07-09-2005, 10:58 PM

Who checks with JJ or QQ or KK on that flop. Who checks the turn if they hit the ace. This hand was played so strangely. You could easily get looked up by some pocket pair and certainly a 9. I am not planning on check-folding are you? Why would you put the players on this hands when there has been exactly zero bets made post flop?

soweak. · #10 07-10-2005, 12:36 AM

I agree with this post.

This value bet, given the post-flop action, will never get called by the passive player with worse hands, and will not get him to fold bigger pairs or AX. The other players, maybe, but we have no reads on them.

Checking and calling depending on who bets is the best plan. Even folding here is ok if the passive player bets.

I would prefer betting the turn, even though it's a scare card. we gain much more info about the strength of our hand with a lead on the turn than we do with a river value bet.