K-10s in SB

cosmo kramer · #1 06-03-2003, 09:20 PM

6-12. Four limpers to me in the SB and I complete with K [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] 10 [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] . BB checks and we are 6 handed.

Flop-10 [img]/forums/images/icons/diamond.gif[/img] 9 [img]/forums/images/icons/diamond.gif[/img] 8 [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img]. I check, utg bets, three calls to me, I call.

Turn-5 [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] . I bet and get three callers.

River-9 [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] . I check. Comments?

lil' · #2 06-03-2003, 11:11 PM

I think I like your turn bet. If you get raised it's pretty easy to fold. I think 2 pair would have raised the flop, so you very well may have the best hand when a brick falls on the turn. You are likely against at least 2, and perhaps 3, draws.
On the river, you are safe from the straight. The only thing you have to worry about is someone hanging around with middle pair, which they shouldn't have been doing. Still, I can't think of a hand that would call you here that you could beat (maybe 7-7, A-8?), so I would check and call.

cosmo kramer · #3 06-04-2003, 02:21 PM

I didn't want to lead at this flop because I could easily get raised by any draw and not know where I was. Also, there are many turn cards that I do not want to see, so I want to invest little at this point. When the brick fell on the turn, I bet to charge all the draws that were out there, and if I got raised I could figure someone had already made there hand. On the river, the only hand that I could see paying me off would be J10, while it was possible that someone could have been hanging around with J9 or even 97. So I checked planning to call a bet.

rkiray · #4 06-04-2003, 02:33 PM

I would bet the flop. I think there is a good chance you are ahead here and you don't want to give a free card to draws. If I'm raised then I slow down.

Homer · #5 06-04-2003, 02:33 PM

I like your play with the exception of the river. I think you have a value bet. If you checked with the intention of calling I think you should just bet it yourself. This is because with three opponents no one is going to bluff at the pot on a busted draw, nor will they bet with made hands like top-pair, weak kicker or third pair (8's). The only bets will come from trip 9's. However, if you bet yourself these worse hands will call and trip 9's will raise, in which case you have an easy fold. Notice that either way you are putting one bet in the pot, but betting is better since worse hands will call whereas when you check they will not bet.

-- Homer

cosmo kramer · #6 06-04-2003, 02:47 PM

I thought about betting the river, but if anyone wanted to take a shot at stealing the pot with a raise, this would be the perfect time. In all honesty, though, I do not think any of my opponents in this hand would take a shot like that, so you are right, I should have bet.

Homer · #7 06-04-2003, 02:55 PM

I guess I didn't explicity state it, but I was kind of alluding to the fact that no one will take a shot at a pot, be it by bluff-raising a bet from you, or by betting a busted flush/straight draw when checked to.

This is because there are four players left in the hand so it would be quite unlikely that such a bluff would be successful.

-- Homer

Ed Miller · #8 06-04-2003, 08:48 PM

You will virtually never see such a bluff raise in this situation. That is because most players with your hand would check the river in this spot ("I can't bet! There's a straight out there and the board is paired!"). It is also because almost no one has the yarbles to attempt a cold bluff-raise in the first place... and especially not in a situation where the bettor has shown so much power, betting a scary board into three opponents.

JTG51 · #9 06-04-2003, 08:52 PM

Yarbles, I like that.

SoBeDude · #10 06-05-2003, 02:04 AM

Notice that either way you are putting one bet in the pot, but betting is better since worse hands will call whereas when you check they will not bet.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I think I look at it a bit differently (and maybe incorrectly).

If I can see the showdown for max 1 bet here, I'd rather do that than pay the same one bet and have exactly 0% chance of winning (due to my fold). So check-call ensures me a 1 bet max showdown. Betting out does not.

So even if the better doesn't have a 9 only 10% of the time, seeing the showdown for 1 bet is a very +EV play, right? or am I missing something?

Is this wrong thinking?

-Scott