Rivered...should I have played this differently?

Yambola · #1 08-18-2003, 07:35 PM

I'm at a loose/very passive .5/1 table at Party. I just sat down and don't know anything about the players.

I get dealt K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] in MP. 3 limpers to me and I limp, 3 more limpers and the BB checks. 8 players see the flop.

Flop: 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

5 checks to me and I bet with JJ, I get 5 callers.

I'm thinking I'm in pretty good shape. The only thing I was worried about was AJ, but since no one raised my bet I'm feeling confident. But as I said, the table was very passive

Turn: J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

4 checks to me and I bet and get 4 callers.

I'm pretty sure I've got this one locked up. Nobody has AJ, and hopefully I'll get some action from Jx, flush, and straight draws

River: 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

3 checks to me and I bet, only get one caller.

Damn...the flush and/or straight draws may have hit their hand, but since I didn't get raised I'm not to worried about it

Sure enough, the other guy turns over QTo for the river straight. Why he didn't raise on the river I have no idea, and just furthers my belief that it is impossible to put someone on a hand at .5/1 because the players are so unpredictable. Oh well, I feel like this is all I could have done, becasue if I attempted a check-raise I would've almost certainly given away a free card to the draws. But maybe I'm wrong...could any of you see this beat coming?

rkiray · #2 08-18-2003, 07:44 PM

You said the table was passive, so this doesn't surprize me at all. Of course he should have been raising with this draw on both the flop and the turn. Just be glad he didn't. I don't think you were going anywhere, nor was he. So you saved money.

Dynasty · #3 08-18-2003, 08:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm pretty sure I've got this one locked up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you realize how dumb that sounds?

[ QUOTE ]
Why he didn't raise on the river I have no idea, and just furthers my belief that it is impossible to put someone on a hand at .5/1 because the players are so unpredictable.

[/ QUOTE ]

When somebody bets the whole way on a board in which the top card pairs and a flush card hits on the river, I'm not rushing in to raise with a straight. I think your opponent played his hand fine.

[ QUOTE ]
But maybe I'm wrong...could any of you see this beat coming?

[/ QUOTE ]

You didn't take a "beat". You lost a hand...and you're whining about it.

Dynasty · #4 08-18-2003, 08:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Of course he should have been raising with this draw on both the flop and the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Raising even the flop with QTo on a board of Jc,9c,2s is rather dubious although not bad. Raising the turn when another Jack hits is just plain foolish.

GuyOnTilt · #5 08-18-2003, 11:55 PM

I would've checked it through on the river. Some people would say bet for value, but I'd check it through at your table. I also don't see this as being "rivered," and it's certainly not a "beat." Someone just hit their open-ender. It happens. You played it fine except for the river bet, in my opinion.

Again though, your thought process throughout this hand (and the last one I responded to) is askew. Some of your comments (as Dynasty already pointed out) sound very immature. Also, you shouldn't even CONSIDER check-raising the turn, as you've been given no indication that a player behind you has a Jack and will bet if checked to. Your tone in this post sounds a little bitter about your loss, but you shouldn't be. It would appear that opponents had 15 cards to beat you with, so you were actually the underdog on the flop to have the best hand at the river (if there was also a flush draw). Definitely not a "beat."

Jeffro · #6 08-19-2003, 09:35 AM

I hate KJo in real loose passive games and would muck it in this position most of the time. I don’t think your giving up much folding this hand as well as hands like A10o, AJo, K10o, QJo, Q10o, J10o from this position in this type of game.
As for the hand would have played it the same way after the flop.

ResidentParanoid · #7 08-19-2003, 09:41 AM

You got off easy when he didn't raise on the river. He's probably a little loose pre-flop with QTo. You played the hand fine. Say "good hand" and wait 'til you get another good flop. These kind of beats happen all the time, especially at 0.5/1.

ResidentParanoid · #8 08-19-2003, 09:44 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I would've checked it through on the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a big mistake at 0.5/1, in my opinion. These tables should have the phrase "worse hands will call" stenciled in the middle of the faux-felt.

Kurn, son of Mogh · #9 08-19-2003, 09:54 AM

You played it fine. You lost. Your opponent flopped a draw and had odds to call all the way. I don't want to sound negative, but this hand should not bother you at all. If it does, maybe poker isn't for you.

ResidentParanoid · #10 08-19-2003, 09:54 AM

I think AJo, QJo and JTo are playable from anywhere on such tables for one bet. You often outkick Axo with the ace, and the many straight possibilities make the other two profitable.

I think ATo and KTo can be played for 1 small bet in late position if you are disciplined with them. Ace and King high flops that are checked to you can be played profitably. Have to be able to let them go when you are beat.

QTo should be thrown away.