Top set on a monotone flop.

[adsman]

Villian had just sat down and posted, so no reads at this point. Is this how you would play it against an unknown?

PokerStars 2/4 Hold'em (6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. CO posts a blind of $2.
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO (poster) checks, Button calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG calls, CO calls, Button calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, Button folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, UTG folds, CO calls.

Turn: (8 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, CO calls.

River: (10 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 14 BB

[@bsolute_luck]

i think if you're betting that river, you need to fold to a raise. or check/call. the rest looks fine.

[POKhER]

Bet fold river or C/C it - not both IMO(A raiser will prob have you beat i.e. A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] which i reckon he held)

Otherwise its gooooood - Flop 3bet is cool cause AJ will raise assuming your bluffing a flush or betting OC's or King[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] or something anyhow.

[aargh57]

I'm thinking check/call. I don't think we're getting called more than 50% when we win in this situation. However, I think that villain will bet quite often in this position with a worse hand either as a bluff or because he thinks he has the best hand (something like 2 pair).

[car ramrod]

looks like he was raising a 1 card flush on flop.
I like the 3bet.
That river is nasty, I don't think you win this enough to call, I may have to check call here, this gives him the option to bet his flush, bluff a flush, or check thru, all of which gets us to showdown.

[jba]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm thinking check/call. I don't think we're getting called more than 50% when we win in this situation. However, I think that villain will bet quite often in this position with a worse hand either as a bluff or because he thinks he has the best hand (something like 2 pair).

[/ QUOTE ]

that makes no sense as an argument for checking instead of betting

[ QUOTE ]
Bet fold river or C/C it - not both IMO(A raiser will prob have you beat i.e. A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] which i reckon he held)

Otherwise its gooooood - Flop 3bet is cool cause AJ will raise assuming your bluffing a flush or betting OC's or King[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] or something anyhow.

[/ QUOTE ]

this post is the money shot, through, to the point, and correct....nice

[aargh57]

I thought that you should only bet when you're going to win the majority of the time when you're called. I don't see how I'm violating this here. If you bet and you're beat he's always going to (at least) call you. If you're ahead he will seldom call you. How do you gain here by betting.

[POKhER]

Asumming this:
Check/call - Losers check, winners bet = -1BB
Bet/fold - Losers fold/Winners raise = -1BB

Check/Call - Losers bluff/Losers check = +1BB
Bet/Fold - Losers call thinking we bluff/Loses fold/Weak tightys fold = +2BB (Is the weak tighty folding thing cool? Im sure ive missed an assumption/situation on the C/C line)



But i think we're assume here that villan will rarely bluff, however he may call a weaker holding.

So vs a tricky opponent C/C
Vs a passive opponent/Calling station B/F

Someone correct me, and identify why betting/folding is clearly superior.

[POKhER]

Ok so after editing the above post like 5 times, i give up finding all the lines.


But basically we need a read to chose the bet line i conclude, and we lack a read.

So as we dont want to lose the whole pot... I think C/C is wiser.

With a read, This would change accordingly.

Bet/fold = Tricky guy raises we must fold!
Check/call = Tricky guy bets we can call.

i think the value of a showdown, Potential losing pot to a bluff out way getting 1Value bet in Vs a guy who MAY MAY MAY CALL THE LOSING HAND.