River

Roy6 · #1 11-28-2005, 11:41 AM

I know it's hard to play these without a read but he was new to the table.

PokerStars 3/6 Hold'em (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, MP calls.

Flop: (5.33 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP checks, Hero bets, MP calls.

Turn: (3.66 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP checks, Hero checks.

River: (3.66 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP bets

PokerStars 3/6 Hold'em (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 2 folds, Button raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, UTG calls, Button calls.

Flop: (9.33 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, UTG calls, Button folds.

Turn: (5.66 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero calls.

River: (7.66 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)

Hero checks, UTG bets,

#2 11-28-2005, 11:46 AM

I would fold the first hand. The pot is small, and with no reads you don't know what he would call down with. It's possible he was checking the flop to set up a turn ckraise. I don't think it's worth a call for 3.66 BB's.

Second hand: The pots bigger but UTG has shown aggression on two streets, what draw could he have been on? I suspect we are beat and probably fold, though I don't think a call is terrible.

bnorthro · #3 11-28-2005, 11:48 AM

I fold the river in hand 1. There's plenty of hands this guy limped with that could have connected.

Hand 2 I think you have to bet the turn. Since you didn't do that, i'd probably call that river. He could very well have a much lower A or K high.

Wynton · #4 11-28-2005, 11:49 AM

Problem isn't the river, but the turn. Both times you should bet the turn, as you are up against only one opponent without a read. If opponent calls the turn bet on first hand, you can c/f the river confidently. In second hand, you may need to c/c if the river is a blank, because it's quite possible villain could be betting on busted draw.

#5 11-28-2005, 11:57 AM

With out a read what draws do you put him on that would call a 3-bet? JT maybe KQ. He could have picked up a flush draw on the turn, but he'd have to have something he liked to call the flop.

bnorthro · #6 11-28-2005, 12:04 PM

[ QUOTE ]
With out a read what draws do you put him on that would call a 3-bet? JT maybe KQ.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm just curious if anyone ever sees someone fold a possible blind steal to a 3-bet preflop?

Edit - nevermind, I'm an idiot and I didn't catch that UTG was in Hand 2. Nevermind.

I still think you need to bet the turn. Without that the river call is harder.

Wynton · #7 11-28-2005, 12:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
With out a read what draws do you put him on that would call a 3-bet? JT maybe KQ. He could have picked up a flush draw on the turn, but he'd have to have something he liked to call the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

He limped utg, and then cc 2 more bets, which hardly means he's got a strong hand. J10 is a definite possibility, as well as a back-door flush draw.

krimson · #8 11-28-2005, 12:37 PM

I think you're missing a lot of opportunities to take down pots by not betting the turn after showing aggression. Lots of players will peel a flop with pretty much any 2 cards, and then give it up on the big streets.

In hand 1, we have position, we can bet this turn (comfortably folding to a raise), and check behind on the river u/i.

In hand 2, the pot is pretty big and he will fold more than 1 in 5 times. We're probably still ahead here and can c/c this river if he calls our turn bet.

gehrig · #9 11-28-2005, 12:37 PM

hand one is bad. bet the turn, check the river. if youre even considering calling the river, then why in the world wouldn't you bet the turn? put the one bet in on the turn and you give him a chance to fold and give yourself a chance to bet again if you improve or check behind if you dont

c/c'ing both big streets in hand two isn't bad. if you're not insta-calling the 4c river then you need to bet/fold the turn

damaniac · #10 11-28-2005, 12:39 PM

I bet the turn in hand 1. I know since we picked up a gutshot it sucks getting c/r, but given the board I expect far more often he called with air hoping to get lucky. The Q might have hit him, but even so he'll often just call, which isn't great but you still get your river outs, and you get him to fold undercard crap that has 6 outs against you and every now and then a PP which he peeled with but hates cuz another broadway card came.