Bad Larrys

Villain in this hand has won about 5 pots in a row, the last two without showing, and is getting extremely frisky. He’s a 30/15/2 with a very hot image right now. He goes nuts when he has a piece, but lays down when he feels beaten.

My image is extremely tight, as I’ve been card dead on this table for about an hour.

Party Poker 30/60 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds</font>, MP1 raises</font>, 3 folds</font>, Hero 3-bets</font>, 2 folds</font>, MP1 calls.

Flop: (7.66 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)</font>
MP1 checks, Hero bets</font>, MP1 calls.

Turn: (4.83 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)</font>
MP1 bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6.83 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)</font>
MP1 bets</font>, Hero raises …


Comments on all streets appreciated, but pls remember the turn call sets up the river raise, so those are sort of on play. I planned to raise any river all along.

[The Truth]

Fold preflop.

Oh oh, fold on the turn too. I'd probably muck the river as well.

blake

[Fianchetto]

I’ve done this, but I don’t think it’s a good play. I think it’s expensive, and usually a sign that it’s time for me to take a break.

The thing about bad larrys is it can’t really win a showdown unimproved, so you ended up planning this elaborate multi street bluff. It really plays better when you can get in cheap and/or be sure of a multiway pot.

If you’ve been card dead and this guy is hot, then I think it’s more likely he makes you showdown a winner. If you’d shown down some strong hands previously then you may have a little more fold equity with this play. Either way, if you have to make a play on this guy I’d much rather do it holding an ace, or a pair, something that you can showdown unimproved.

[ QUOTE ]
Fold preflop.

Oh oh, fold on the turn too. I'd probably muck the river as well.

blake

[/ QUOTE ]

Totally unhelpful.

[ QUOTE ]
I’ve done this, but I don’t think it’s a good play. I think it’s expensive, and usually a sign that it’s time for me to take a break.

The thing about bad larrys is it can’t really win a showdown unimproved, so you ended up planning this elaborate multi street bluff. It really plays better when you can get in cheap and/or be sure of a multiway pot.

If you’ve been card dead and this guy is hot, then I think it’s more likely he makes you showdown a winner. If you’d shown down some strong hands previously then you may have a little more fold equity with this play. Either way, if you have to make a play on this guy I’d much rather do it holding an ace, or a pair, something that you can showdown unimproved.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good points. I figured there was a good chance he had absolutely nothing at all, and maybe picked up a turn flush draw or wanted me to think AK.

As for being card dead, I had shown a couple of solid winners down earlier (KK and AQs), but hadn't played in a while.

[ALL1N]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Fold preflop.

Oh oh, fold on the turn too. I'd probably muck the river as well.

blake

[/ QUOTE ]

Totally unhelpful.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're the guy who limped TT in the SB and wouldn't back down about that either, right?? Are you here to learn or to teach?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Fold preflop.

Oh oh, fold on the turn too. I'd probably muck the river as well.

blake

[/ QUOTE ]

Totally unhelpful.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're the guy who limped TT in the SB and wouldn't back down about that either, right?? Are you here to learn or to teach?

[/ QUOTE ]

A little of both I suppose.

Notice I did think the poster who actually took some time to analyze the hand had some good points. So maybe you should back off a touch.

[elindauer]

I admire your courage. Your opponent is on a rush and trying to win every pot, so you know he's not just going to give up when you 3-bet him. He's probably going to play back at you at some point, so you know going in you're going to have to play the hand like you did.

And you choose to get involved anyways. I think you can turn a small profit this way, but with huge swings. Personally, I'd just muck and hope to pick up a hand with some showdown value next deal.

-eric

[bernie]

The play looks awkward. FPS.

Raise the turn, then bet the river when checked to if you're planning on seeing the river. Same price, more believable. What are you trying to represent? A turned set? I wouldn't really be putting you on a 9 given your play. I'd call just out of curiousity.

[ QUOTE ]
My image is extremely tight, as I’ve been card dead on this table for about an hour.

[/ QUOTE ]

You may be giving them too much credit for reading you this way. You're projecting your read on yourself on them. Base your image off the action you receive, not how you 'think' you look just because you've been folding.

b

[ QUOTE ]
The play looks awkward. FPS.

Raise the turn, then bet the river when checked to if you're planning on seeing the river. Same price, more believable. What are you trying to represent? A turned set? I wouldn't really be putting you on a 9 given your play. I'd call just out of curiousity.

[ QUOTE ]
My image is extremely tight, as I’ve been card dead on this table for about an hour.

[/ QUOTE ]

You may be giving them too much credit for reading you this way. You're projecting your read on yourself on them. Base your image off the action you receive, not how you 'think' you look just because you've been folding.

b

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting, but I believe a turn raise is much less believable in this spot than a river raise. A river raise looks like I've trapped him with AK, KK, or AA. A turn raise is something I think he'd call down a lot more with as little as ace high, because it would look to him like I am trying to simply continue my aggression even if I've missed. The turn call reeks of a monster to an observant player (and he was one, but more on this in a bit), and the river raise keeps up the charade.

For what it's worth, I am thinking he's on ace high by the time the river comes around, as he'd have reraised me PF with AK or any PP, and would have checkraised the turn with a K in his hand. If he's got a 9, well, so be it. I've been representing major strength the entire way, so I'd fold to the 3 bet here.

Also, I believe that not giving people enough credit for perceiving what's going on at the table is a major error good players make. I believe he did notice I had shown quality hands down and had not played a lot--that's why I set up this play the way I did.

I'm not sure if I am happy about the way I played this hand or not. On the one hand I think it was a very sophisticated move. On the other hand, it was perhaps too sophisticated.