In what order should I study?

I have TOP sitting in front of me. I have read just over 100 pages in the book.

I just picked up SSHE (ordered it and it arrived at the bookstore).

I love reading the forums, posting hands, responding to them, reading threads suggested by players here, reading responses to mine, etc.

I am also playing, sometimes multi-tabling, sometimes taking it easy because I am trying to study while just playing one table (just to keep the need satisfied!) [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

My question is probably too subjective to really get a solid answer, but I am at a loss, and wouldn't mind some guidance from someone with experience here...

I want to finish TOP, then move on to read SSHE, then I can come back to the forums.

Then, I can check "this" post, respond to "that" post, and I will have other books to read as well (have some in my library that I set aside until I finish SSHE and TOP).

I am jumping back and forth, getting bits and pieces of information from everywhere, but I have been trying to read TOP for almost two weeks now and every time I get started, I find another thread that piques my interest, or something else poker related that takes me away from reading it...

So, I ask you, is it a good plan to

1) for now, completely forego the forums
2) finish reading TOP
3) read SSHE
4) return to the forum to discuss the wisdom therein, at which point I can begin either reading the books I had, up to that point, set aside, and/or re-read TOP and SSHE, and/or move on to something like HPFAP and/or HOH 1&2

Sound like a plan? I know the forums aren't going anywhere, and although they are a tremendous wisdom sink, I may gain more by finishing TOP and SSHE before coming back here...

It is funny but since I started playing at the $1/$2 tables not many days ago, I went back and re-read Ed Miller's post about leaks, and found numerous insights that didn't click as much as they did this time... Funny how just a few weeks can completely change your perspective.

I even have some books I have read that I am sure will deserve a second (and + ) read at some point in the relatively near future, and I will probably laugh at the way I (mis)interpreted the information the first time.

For now, I am just hoping for honest opinions and/or suggestions on the best route to take.

No forums, no multi-tabling (or maybe max 2 at a time?), read TOP, read SSHE, then come back to forums and relax - the rest I can read at my leisure, like SS, SS2, HOH, HPFAP, etc, once I have finished TOP and SSHE and can start putting the wisdom therein into fundamental application.

Sound good?

I suggest that you read SSHE before the Theory of Poker. It sounds like you are playing small stakes(1$-2$) anyway. Unless you already have a good understanding of hold 'em in general. Also, you should note that the Theory of Poker uses a lot of examples with razz and 7-card stud. If you don't care about these games, then a good understanding of hold 'em is required before being able to apply a 7-card move into hold 'em. I might be wrong in assuming that these are your first books, but I think that a general hold em book is better to read before the Theory of Poker. Also, don't read the books too fast. Read a chapter and then apply it in a real game. Don't move through the Theory of Poker too fast or you'll miss some of the wisdom in it. Sounds like you're on your way to being a great hold 'em player. Good luck with your poker education. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Can you throw down the link for Ed Miller's post about leaks. I'm a noob round these parts, and haven't seen it yet. Just tried searching for it to no avail thanks.

Thanks Pauwl.

I started playing hold em last summer and spent a lot of time in NL SNGs and MTTs. I moved to limit because I wanted a change of pace (note the games I had been playing were almost exclusively play money or freerolls, but I always played as though it were real money, and I did very well - I won some, and place near the top in many)

I have already read the NL section of SS, I read a portion of the LHE section of SS and then got TOP, so I started reading that instead.

Last summer, the first book I bought and read cover to cover was Gary Carson's book (mentioned in SSHE, covers hand selection very well, esp considering it deserved mention in SSHE, on more than one occasion).

I have also read one of the Tom McEvoy/TJ books (read it in a day, and I am a slow reader). Also read the WPT book by Mike Sexton (some good hands in it, and a bit of info, but most of it I already knew - nice to have the DVD though, can play it for friends and family [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Also own three of John Vorhaus' books, have read 1.5 of them, will complete those in due time.

So, I have a fair bit of working experience in hold em, and went from playing for play money in early summer, to playing for pennies at Pacific poker after winning a couple of freerolls (and a few freerolls at absolute I keep forgetting - came in 4th in one, out of 2000, and 5th in another, and there were others on other sites, but you get the point, I hope!), to bonus whoring and feeling comfortable playing the $1/$2 tables - that is a very short span of time to go from the play money tables to the $1/$2, from what I understand, but I don't think of it as $, I think of it as units, and I am just playing at the unit level, regardless if it is 10 cents or $2. Yes, the game changes, but it always does, based on the people against whom you play. I see it this way: there are players who are (and may forever) be better than me, but MOST players on this planet are worse than me. Since I only need to be better than some of the players at my table, that is always a guarantee. I just need to stay out of the way of the better players (for now heh). Some say I am running hot... I have good days and I have bad days. A bad day (downswing) for me is when my QQ gets beaten by KK in the hole, or when my KK gets topped by AA, or AQ loses to AK - lost $140 at those $1/$2 tables that way a few days ago. Earned it all back the next day. Slow and steady. I must be doing something right... I just wish I knew how to tweak all those little things I do wrong.

I am already a reasonable player, but there are times I don't understand enough to know why to make a certain play in a certain situation, hence the need for TOP, SSHE, and the forums.

That being said, I understand that SSHE is specific to HE, but if TOP applies to poker in general, does it not provide a very solid foundation, more in depth than SSHE?

And therefore, would it not be a good thing to build a better fundamental platform of knowledge by reading TOP before SSHE?

I guess arguments can be made either way... I just wish the authors of the books would pop up and provide an answer, but I won't hope for that much...

I do owe them a case of scotch, or whatever they drink, just for going through the trouble of writing these books - they are a godsend, and even though I have barely touched SSHE, I know it ranks right up there with TOP, I can tell because I have read Ed's posts here more than once, and glean more from them each time.

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Can you throw down the link for Ed Miller's post about leaks. I'm a noob round these parts, and haven't seen it yet. Just tried searching for it to no avail thanks.


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The first link is for where I got the second and third links

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...14&fpart=1

Second link is the leak post

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...amp;PHPSESSID=

Third link is another great post by Ed about crushing LLHE

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...14&fpart=1


And welcome to the forums noob! (lol you have more posts than I do) (erm, I thought you did but now I see I have 5 more than you - so you are a noob!) [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Ed Miller]

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I do owe them a case of scotch, or whatever they drink, just for going through the trouble of writing these books...

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Glenlivet will be fine.

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Glenlivet will be fine.


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Man also has an appreciation of good whiskey, too!

[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[BarronVangorToth]

And he wasn't even greedy enough to ask for the '59 run...

Barron Vangor Toth
BarronVangorToth.com

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And he wasn't even greedy enough to ask for the '59 run...



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Yeah, I noticed, but thought maybe that was a tad "in" to mention.

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Glenlivet will be fine.

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bah - Glenlivet - gut rot [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

seriously though - thanks mate!

er, but, while you were here, you could have made a suggestion [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] Guy shows up for the scotch though! [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] Ed, do you have a bot that searches the forum for the words "I owe & Ed Miller & Scotch" [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

I will assume that since you didn't offer your opinion, that it either doesn't really matter how long it takes me to study any/all of the above, as long as I do it, and don't go broke trying, OR that I have already made the correct choice and that finishing TOP then reading SSHE then coming back to the forums will work. Or that I am wasting so much time asking pointless questions and making snide remarks that could be much better spent studying. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

And here I was hoping to hear it from Yoda himself (sorry, if you prefer a different Jedi reference, I can replace that) [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]