Playing overcards (that hit the turn) in a huge pot?

emitch · #1 09-20-2005, 08:52 PM

Hello,
Playing overcards is one of the areas I have been trying to work on along with getting my AF=1.65 up. I have had several situations like this lately and regardless of results, I think this is where I may be missing quite a few bets/raises and calling too much. I actually don't have a lot of trouble playing the overcards unless I run into strong aggression, which I did in this hand. The villian is new to the table <15 hands, but has been at least 50% of them and pushing everyone hard. Advice is appreciated.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. CO posts a blind of $0.50.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, CO (poster) calls, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Standard

Flop: (12 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, Hero calls, CO calls, SB folds.

Missed, I would guess this is where I should raise to clean out overcards behind me? My thoughts were, that with this many players, I was definately behind to at least one pair. Call because of pot odds/size.

Turn: (8.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB bets, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, Hero raises, CO calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Good card, so raise the overagg BB. He calls, so I figure I'm ahead, with several draws against my top pair.

River: (18.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB bets, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, Hero calls, CO calls.

Villian bets into me, and remembering that most players will not bluff the river especially in a large pot, I call. I figured the villian hit two pair with the four or stop and go. This card also helped out several draws and with this many along, that had me worried too. Was a raise in order here?

Final Pot: 21.50 BB

Redd · #2 09-20-2005, 08:57 PM

Nice hand. Cleaning up outs on the flop is unnecessary because K8/Q8, etc are unlikely. I'd rather raise for a free card, but that could be tough one off the button in a big field with a big pot.

River call is fine because he's not gonna bluff into 5 people in a pot this size.

tyler_cracker · #3 09-20-2005, 09:09 PM

I like the flop call, but i think your reason is wrong. It doesn't matter that you're behind to a pair, because if you hit a pair, you will be ahead (ignoring times when you're reverse dominated, but you're screwed there anyway). You have unfortunate relative position to the LAG, and those dudes trapped in the middle aren't folding for one more (small) bet. You currently have no hand to protect, so just call and re-evaluate on the turn.

I like the river call mostly because CO is making me nervous. He cold-called 2 on the turn and that card just completed a lot of draws. Getting 3-bet would suck, and i doubt he's folding better hands (though he might call with some stupid worse hand -- as it looks like he did here).