How do I stop losing money with the nut low here?

[aces_full]

Well they say you get what you pay for, and I seem to be getting it here.....

Here's the scenario: I'm playing $25 PLO8. I have played limit up to $1/$2 but last week I decided to try pot limit. I made a rule for myself that I don't chase draws for half the pot on the flop if I'm facing a big bet. However, I still have managed to get myself in trouble. There were three similar hands that came up this past weekend. Each time I was in one of the last two seats where I limped in with a bare A2. Maybe part of my problem is over-valuing A2 hands even in late position. Each time I flop the nut low draw with no high and I say to myself, "any big bet and I'm done" Well either it gets checked around, or some donk bets .50 and I say to myself "I have pot odds". Every single time the nut low comes on the turn. The first time it happened a player bets pot,gets one caller, and it's folded to me. I call. The river is of no consequence and all I have is low. The bettor fires again, the next guy raises, and we both call. The original bettor turned a straight, and the other guy has A2 and I'm quartered to the tune of $8. Yuck. Second time, I have the bare A2 for low draw and a player bets .50 on the flop. I call again because of "pot odds" and again wind up screwed. Low comes on turn, guy who bet .50 on flop now pots it and I am the only caller on the turn and river, only to be shown an A2 and some weak high hand for another quartering to the tune of $5. Third time was a little different as there was no action. Again I'm the button in a 4 way limped pot with a bare A2. I flop the nut low draw, and there are two diamonds. It gets checked through. The turn was a low [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] giving me the low and making a possible flush. It's checked to me and I decide to bet $1 on the nut low and hopefully put some dead money in the pot. Everyone calls. The river was a rag and everyone checks to me again. This time I bet $2 and everyone calls. One player had a small flush for high, and the other two players both had an A2-hexed!!! Luckily this pot was small, only lost .85 there. But yuck, since I switched from limit to pot limit, it seems like I am doing nothing but getting into trouble when I make the nut low.

[TGoldman]

It's not a question of pot odds. Any draw that you aren't comfortable betting aggressively if it hits is not a draw worth playing. This is the case with a naked A2 drawing to the nut low. How do you avoid that situation? Simply don't do it.

[Wintermute]

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Each time I was in one of the last two seats where I limped in with a bare A2.

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Late position, just raise the max wiht A2. No A2 is "bare" you always have a draw to high. By raising, you have a chance to blow crappy high hands out on the flop with a strong bet.


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The original bettor turned a straight

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This hand will frequently not see the turn if you play it right.


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One player had a small flush for high

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This should virtually never happen when a low is on the board, if you are playing correctly.

Of course, you will still have to be wary of getting quartered by another A2, but in general taking the aggressive lead w/ A2 from late position will work out favorably for you... give it a shot.

[Chamonyx]

I think it is Steve Badger's site that talks about the importance of "and" in PLO8. As in "I have nut low AND x for high". Now, x can be relatively little (even top pair, for example) but if all you have early in the hand is a naked low, then be ready to give it up. When you play A2, you are always looking for the coordination between your hand and the flop that gives you enough of an x to drive the betting so that you can either get rid of or punish those that want to stay in with just a low.

Incidentally, I have noticed how the (expensive) lessons I learn from PLO8 have really helped my limit game, especially in tournaments. In particular, being able to walk away from very marginal situations and wait for better opportunities to put my chips to play.

If the 25PLO8 game you are playing is on party, then you also have to be ready for some big swings and suck outs (and your x needs to be bigger than in better games). I have found the games on Stars to be a much better place to get comfortable with the game, uncluttered by bad play suck-outs.

Good luck.

[emptyshell]

You need to make more potsized bets with your low draws when others seem weak. Drive small flushes, gutshot straight draws out.

At the $25 level, though, you can just wait until you flop a monster before you put your money in. You won't win as much, but your variance will be lower.

[HopeydaFish]

This has already been answered properly, but I'll repeat it to emphasize their points...you need to drive your opponents out of these pots, otherwise you'll always end up settling for a quarter (or less) of low, and will never get the high. If it gets checked around to you, and you're on a nut low draw, a pot sized bet will usually chase out almost everyone. Many times you will also chase out the other A2 who doesn't want to stay in with "only" a draw to the nut low.

Being passive is your problem.