Value raising a flush draw?

OrianasDaad · #1 07-20-2005, 01:35 AM

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

UTG+2 is a maniac, plays every hand past the flop.
CO is slightly loose and aggressive.
BB is a calling station.

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Hero raises, 1 fold, UTG+2 calls, 3 folds, CO calls, 2 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, UTG+2 raises, CO 3-bets, BB calls, Hero caps, UTG+2 calls, CO calls, BB calls.

Turn: (12.25 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, UTG+2 raises, CO calls, BB calls, Hero 3-bets, UTG+2 caps, CO calls, BB calls, Hero calls.

River: (28.25 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, Hero checks, UTG+2 bets, CO raises, BB calls, Hero folds, UTG+2 calls.

Final Pot: 34.25 BB

Kumubou · #2 07-20-2005, 01:40 AM

The flop is fine -- you have so many outs (9 to the nut flush, 4 to the nut straight -- 12 total, since one card gives you OMFG ROYAL. I doubt your overs are any good, though) with so many people to go you can ram-jam.

This is not true on the turn -- not enough cards to come. The initial bet is not bad if you think people may fold, but it looks like no one is going anywhere. The 3-bet is just rampant spewing, or 'lol let's build a pot and gamb000000l lol'; however you look at it.

[edit: Since UTG+1 is a nutbag, your overs may or may not be good. The 3-bet on the turn is still spew, though.]

-K

Redd · #3 07-20-2005, 01:43 AM

I don't think I'd keep pushing after being raised on the turn; if even 1 of your outs is tainted (which they may be given the action), you're 3.2:1 to improve and getting the short end of the equity stick. I think betting will even be -EV in the long run, but that may be because I saw him raise.

grjr · #4 07-20-2005, 01:45 AM

yup, once you whiff on the turn you should be out of "build the pot" mode and into "let's see the river as cheap as I can" mode.

#5 07-20-2005, 02:00 AM

[ QUOTE ]
yup, once you whiff on the turn you should be out of "build the pot" mode and into "let's see the river as cheap as I can" mode.

[/ QUOTE ]

Percy101 · #6 07-20-2005, 02:04 AM

Flop: 12 outs to straight/flush and another 3 for overcards -good value

Turn: Could well be against a set here -should probably discard outs to overcards and knock off 2 from the flush draw- leaves 10 strong outs with pot equity just below 25% -marginal call rather than raise.

Entity · #7 07-20-2005, 02:05 AM

Turn play sucks.

benneh · #8 07-20-2005, 02:21 AM

im not convinced we can give hero the additional 3 outs for overcards in this pot.

but i think your flop play is fine. the turn sucks.

ArturiusX · #9 07-20-2005, 02:22 AM

Remember, your equity for draws goes way down once you hit the turn, because you only have 1 card to see.

Lower equity = calling.

Dieter01 · #10 07-20-2005, 02:54 AM

I would play the same for one reason; bragging rights to say that the one time I hit my Royal Flush I actually got payed off royally by 3 players in a huge pot that was capped on every street!

Otherwise, slow down on the turn...