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#1
09-08-2005, 12:33 AM
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How many bets do you put in on the river?
I was playing on the Cryptologic network this evening, and if you're not aware, the site allows unlimited raises and re-raises on the river if the players are HU, until one or both are all in (this rule may also apply on other streets, I'm not really sure).
Two hands arose where I found myself HU at the river with a strong hand, wondering how many bets to put in (let us assume for the purposes of this exercise that your opponent will NEVER stop re-raising, meaning you can get all in or just call at any point). Hand 1: I have KQo and raise first in from the CO. Only the BB calls. The flop is 3KQ rainbow. BB bets, I raise, BB calls. The turn is a 6. BB bets, I raise, he calls. The river is a Q. BB bets, I raise, BB re-raises, I four bet, BB 5 bets, etc. After the 5 bet the BB has 30 more big bets, and I have him covered. Note that I have the second nuts and only lose to KK. No read. Hand 2: EP limps, I raise in MP with AKo. The SB three bets, EP calls, and I just call. The flop is KQ4. SB bets, EP calls, I raise, SB 3 bets, EP folds, I call. The turn is an 8. SB bets, I call. The river is a K. SB bets, I raise, SB 3 bets, here we go... After his 3 bet the SB has 23 more big bets, and I again have him covered. I have been with this player for a while, and my note on him says that he is very aggressive, and pushes very hard with almost any playable hand. I have seen him caught with TPNK on several occasions. My read PF was AA, KK, or QQ, with AK being a smaller possibility. A weaker hand is possible as he is a little maniacal, but he IS in the SB. Post flop I felt AA or QQ was the most likely (note for KK he would have to have the case kings). On the river it is obvious he cannot have KK and I am now beating AA, but still lose to QQ. I also lose to a K that hit it's kicker (KQ, K8, and K4) and split with AK. I think the chances of AK or a K that has hit it's kicker is very remote. Note that my hand here is fairly strong, but not anywhere near the nuts. I'm not looking for a critique of any of my earlier play, I simply want to know how many bets you would put in on the river (again, assume your opponent will re-raise until he is all in). I know the answer is 'it depends' on what you're comfortable with, etc. I would still like to hear some people's thoughts on this, and their reasoning. For the curious, results are in white below: <font color="white"> Hand 1: Villain has 33, good for threes full of queens. Hero has queens full of kings and takes the pot. Hand 2: Villain has K9o, good for trip kings with Q9 kicker. Hero has trip kings with AQ kicker and takes the pot. And yes, I did have the note on him before this hand. w00t! </font> 
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#3
09-08-2005, 01:07 AM
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Re: How many bets do you put in on the river?
[ QUOTE ]
I have KQo and raise first in from the CO. Only the BB calls. The flop is 3KQ rainbow. BB bets, I raise, BB calls. [/ QUOTE ] You said you lose only to KK, and there are only two kings left in the deck. I read somewhere that if you have to put your opponent on two specific cards, you are seeing monsters under the bed. Also, wouldn't he reraise the preflop or flop? Not only is it highly unlikely he as the case K's, he had to be playing them suuuuuper tricky. I max this bad boy out. Hand two is a little scarier, because SB has been pretty aggressive all the way. If you are scared to cap the flop, why do you feel confident pushing the river? You have essentially the same hand.
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#4
09-08-2005, 01:21 AM
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Re: How many bets do you put in on the river?
Hand 1: All you can eat. He doesn't have KK.
Hand 2: Given your read, I think I'm willing to go 7 bets on the river. I call an 8 bet, but still expect to win. How many bets did you go on each of these?
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#7
09-08-2005, 09:29 AM
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Re: How many bets do you put in on the river?
Hand 1: Go to the felt.
Hand 2: Villain heard you raise PF, he sees the pair of Ks on board, and yet he's still blasting away. He has to know that AK is a very live possibility for your hand, so after he's put in a couple of raises you need to recognize that you're either chopping with another AK or losing to QQ. I would only put in 3 or 4 or so raises here.
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#8
09-08-2005, 12:52 PM
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Re: How many bets do you put in on the river?
[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: Go to the felt. Hand 2: Villain heard you raise PF, he sees the pair of Ks on board, and yet he's still blasting away. He has to know that AK is a very live possibility for your hand, so after he's put in a couple of raises you need to recognize that you're either chopping with another AK or losing to QQ. I would only put in 3 or 4 or so raises here. [/ QUOTE ]
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#10
09-08-2005, 02:31 PM
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Re: How many bets do you put in on the river?
I have not looked results or other replies
Hand 1 - I'm putting in like 15 bets at least. I think he has a weaker queen or lower full house basically all the time. That's how he played the hand at least. If he hasn't slowed down after this number of bets I give him credit for KK. Hand 2 - I maybe put in a couple more bets, just based on your read that he might overplay his hand. But if he doens't slow down soon I probably do after 5-6 bets as you have had QQ as a strong possibility the whole time. Or KQ.
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